Adobe Vs. Apple: Whose Side Are You On?

Adobe: We Love Apple, But They're Taking Away Freedom

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It’s no secret that Adobe and Apple have been exchanging quite the back and fourth lately. Steve Jobs put out his letter about not using Flash on Apple’s devices, and Adobe fired back.

Essentially, the skinny of it is that Apple will not support Flash, as it considers HTML5 to be the way forward, and Adobe thinks its Flash technology is as relevant as ever, and will continue to be.

Do you think Flash will continue to play an important role moving forward? Comment here.

Adobe has gone so far as to start an ad campaign around the dispute. Some sites like Engadget, which brought the campaign to the industry’s attention, are displaying the ads:

Adobe's Apple Ads

Adobe Co-founders have written a letter about their "thoughts on open markets", which concludes by saying:

We believe that Apple, by taking the opposite approach, has taken a step that could undermine this next chapter of the web — the chapter in which mobile devices outnumber computers, any individual can be a publisher, and content is accessed anywhere and at any time.

In the end, we believe the question is really this: Who controls the World Wide Web? And we believe the answer is: nobody — and everybody, but certainly not a single company.

Update: Apple has now apparently sent out an email campaign advertising Adobe’s CS5 from the Apple Retail Store.

Google I/O begins Wednesday (we’ll be covering it – watch for live video), and Flash will no doubt be a large topic of discussion throughout the event, as Google’s Android plafform does support it. According to Engadget Android 2.2 and Flash "run like butter" on Google’s Nexus One phone. Google may in fact be the biggest winner in the Apple vs. Adobe debate, because if nothing else, it has painted Android (usage of which is already growing significantly) as an iPhone alternative that supports Flash.

This past week, popular online video site Hulu said it would be sticking with Flash over HTML5 for the foreseeable future.

Apple Holic Johnny Evans points to a free iPhone app called Cloud Browse, which lets users remotely control a Firefox browser with the results streamed to you on your iPhone. "This big brouhaha between Adobe and Apple over Flash sure is amusing," he writes. "But is it really necessary? I mean, everyone knows there’s an app for everything, right? So why’s Flash an exception? It’s not."

Either way, this still illustrates a demand for Flash.

Apple’s advertising strategy seems to be aimed at looking forward, which is really why the company started this to begin with (per Jobs’ letter) The new iPad commercial claims its device as the beginning of a revolution.

What are your thoughts on this whole debate? Who’s right – Apple or Adobe? Both? Neither? Let us know what you think.

Adobe Vs. Apple: Whose Side Are You On?
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  • http://www.em3marketing.com Janyer Dominguez

    Steve Jobs is a paranoid son of a beach that is convinced Adobe’s Flash Player on the iPhone will take over the iphone OS and his app store business will go down the drain. New operating systems will be developed in Flash running on top of the iphone OS. With Flash Player being a complete environment
    anything can be done to under-mind the iPhone OS and we all know how exclusive Apple can be.

  • http://www.racingmodels.co.uk Wim Wellinghoff

    Corporate battles are bad for those who use the warriors’ products. They may lose sight of other competitors growing their businesses on the back of these battles. Apple must tow the line. Whilst their machines are brilliant, except for the prices (look at the iPad pricing..!) the saying “be good to your customers on your way up, you may need them on your way down…..” is appropriate. Mr. Jobs, get flash to run on your equipment and forget silly personal battles!

  • Guestestest

    The question is:

    Is flash the future of the web? There is no doubt it still is integral & embedded in the “web experience” right now and has been for years.

    Don’t be too quick to judge this book by its cover.

    Apple argues that HTML5 will replace Flash – and it might. I haven’t seen any evidence of the validity of the claim, however.


    If Nintendo supports Flash and begins to take some Apple share it might get more interesting as far as i’m concerned.

  • James Dorans

    Without Adobe Apple would not be around today. In the early days of computers Apple was considered to be a Graphic Designers/Artist best friend. Adobe was the one that made that possible. Adobe is still the for runner of graphic programs(Photoshop, Illustrator), and with the addition of Macromedia(Flash, Dreamweaver and Director) that is even more true today.

    Also considering YouTube also uses Flash since movies are translated to FLV format.

    • Guest

      Apple would certainly not have been so successful in the early days without Adobe Pagemaker but the reverse applies also. Without the Mac, Adobe would almost certainly not exist.

      Dreamweaver is so full of bugs I gave up using it after years of putting up with the mess. It would be a great application without all the bugs.

  • Guest

    Lots of people use both, so the best outcome is peaceful coexistence. That being said, I and millions of others benefit from seamless Apple control over their entire product. Over the years that has put them at odds with Microsoft, Firewire users, ADB plug accessory vendors, floppy drive lovers, beige plastic producers, and a host of other ancillary device makers. I remember the howling over the demise of the floppy. The CD/DVD interests will be next based on success of iPhone/Touch/Pad.

    Truth is, we love great products that work. No one is doing that better than Apple right now. Leadership is about the courage of taking your chosen path without looking back. Adobe will have to adapt if they want to stay relevant. Apple is a market leader and they succeed by setting standards for others to follow.

    The guy who invented the two prong electrical plug no doubt had to endure derisive comments from the monied interests who made their fortunes on a six prong plug.

    • Guest

      Great post. I agree 100%.

      I have never liked Flash or PDF because I like pictures, videos, documents I can edit. I also like file formats that can easily be used across different applications.

      I honestly see zero benefits for users and the only advantages I see for developers are that Flash makes copying a little more difficult.

      I always avoid flash and probably always will.

      I don’t believe Apple is trying to control the Web but Adobe certainly is. I have used Adobe and Mac since the very beginning and while Mac has evolved in leaps and bounds consistently leading the way for others to desperately try to catch up Adobe products have got more complicated they are now desperately trying to get everyone to use Flash so they are cornered into Abobe products instead of the much more flexible and cross compatible formats.

      Maybe if Adobe followed Apple guide lines so their software had less problems with Apple OS updates Apple may be a little more easy on them.

  • http://franciscokattan.com Francisco Kattan

    Did you catch the contradiction in Steve’s “Thoughts on Flash” article?

    He first says that the reason is “based on technology issues.” But later he goes on to cite a purely business reason as “the most important reason” he banned Flash.

    More on this here:


  • http://www.sitebyjames.coom James

    Not on either side… I plan to enjoy flash websites whenever I come across them. I also plan on using both Adobe and Apple products for the rest of my life, most likely.

    I don’t know Adobe, I don’t know Steve Jobs…

    That about says it…

  • http://www.thehostinginsider.com Dave

    I understand Apple’s need to ensure its products and software work great together, that’s partly what made Apple great, however, they are starting to behave similar to Microsoft did before the justice department looked into them.

  • Andy

    I think Apple are fairly hypocritical. I have used Apple kit since the IIe, but also use PCs. Apple have always taken a high moral stance, particularly against Microsoft, for years they dissed intel with campaigns pro Motorola, then pro Power PC until finally crossing to Intel and now toying with the move to AMD.

    They are control freaks. They are the only company who still wants hardware / software totality. They want to control the iPhone App developer community, they want their slice of the action in the App store and they want to control how developers develop for it and channel as much of the cash their way as possible…

    I am not a Flash developer, have always preferred working with a text editor and code, I like their products but I use them selectively. I dont like the way Apple seems to want to own the whole environment, it harks back to the old days…

  • http://www.horsesinasia.com/ Johnny

    The only good thing about Apple is its hardware design. Apple hardware/software technology has always been closed and guarded much better than state secrets. Main reason for this is to control market share and to make sure they get a cut of anything that runs on it, like apps for example.

    Outcome of this control is even less control. Apple only has less than10% share of the PC market. Main reason for this is the pricing. Besides a few rich geeks, who would want to pay $4000++ for a mac when you can get a pc for less than quarter of the price and can do so much more with it. Face it, if the internet was exclusive for mac, it wont be as popular as it is today.

    Now we have the ipad (what a name), which is going for $500++. rick geeks + wannabees immediately flock to it because of the affordability and say it is the next big thing which will take over the netbook world. lol. Take over the netbook. yeah right. It cant multitask, not compatible with usb and worse! No Flash!!. 90% of video content is on flash.

    Apple’s reason for not adopting flash is because it uses a lot of power and resources. Boy is flash bad. lol. Mr Steve Jobs does not realize by saying this, he is indirectly admitting that the ipad is not as stable or powerful as other similar devices which can run flash with no problems at all.

    • http://liveguitartutor.com Bob S.

      I must beg to differ with this comment. Apple’s Mac OS was the reason I switched over from Windows in the mid 90s!! Mac OS X is imho the best thing Apple has achieved. Apple are always looking forward and making strides that are sometimes controversial (they were the first to abandon floppy disks and drives, for example). A lot of users grumbled when OS X was introduced, well except the Unix people LOL but anyway, my point is that Apple are making great software too.

  • Kevin

    The biggest complaint I hear from iPhone users is they can’t see Flash. Sounds like a big blunder on Apple’s part that they are trying to cover over by blaming the other guy, which is Adobe in this case. Apple should quit their tirade, man up and fix their software to work with Flash. People want to watch movies and clips from TV shows on various sites – that’s part of the charm that was pitched with the iPhone… see the websites how they are. That has not yet been delivered and is an unfulfilled promise in many eyes.

    • http://liveguitartutor.com Bob S.

      I agree with you, I own an iPhone 3Gs and though I love the little guy, I am a tad tired of not being able to watch videos on YouTube. Having said that, the new H264 codec is GREAT because of its ability to maintain high compression ratios and still maintain visual quality.

      Apple and Adobe have been such good bed mates for so long, this new development is a tad alarming for sure.

  • http://www.BlogosaurusStampede.com Flash Guy

    Kinda like Windows… We all know how successful Apple was at killing that platform…

    • http://liveguitartutor.com Bob S.

      Apple nearly died while Jobs was away. He returned in 1996 and saved the company from drowning in it own mismanagement.

      I sure hope you’re not trying to defend Microsoft. Their OS has always been released before it was ready, much to the chagrin of the many millions who use it, and continue to use it despite its inferiority.

      Many people also think that Macs are overpriced, but guess what, buy a Win PC and try to resell it. Unless it’s a gaming PC, forget it! On the other hand, Macs have excellent resale value. I just recently sold a G4 1GHz model for $700 CAD with a few upgrades. So my initial investment was well worth it! Not to mention that TIME is money too, and Macs have allowed my computing enviroment to be much more productive and stress-free. Surely the extra money for Macs is worth this???

      • Guest

        Excellent, Bob S. You said it ALL!

  • http://cozumelmexico.net Bob Rodriguez

    Although I run most of my content using HTML/text/pictures, I do sprinkle in flash intros and effects here and there. I find that it entertains, informs, engages, and interacts with our 18 million visitors per year.

    Why would anyone want to take that experience away from their customer base?

    Could it possibly have anything to do with royalties?

    Of course not! Job’s moral compass is way beyond that! LOL

  • Rob S.

    Apple has always been about profits first and humanity second.

  • Guest

    Flash may be the Adobe application of the day which represents the epitome of system resource and battery sucking gluttony, it is by no means the only Adobe application with such poorly structured code. As a disgruntled user of Flash, Photoshop, and Acrobat Professional, I find them all system sucking, poor neighbors with other programs and simply unhappy residents in a Windows environment. If there were a powerful alternative to Acrobat I would relish the possibilities.

    • Guest

      Are you a flash expert to say that?
      I am dealing daily with PHP, Java and Flash bugs and what I know for sure is that: a single quote in any of those languages code can kill a computer if used in the wrong place, the difference is just as PHP would kill a server side application rather than your browser while Java or Flash would kill visitor’s terminal, ‘cose they are running locally. I am using simple words but I doubt your overheated and unstable brain will get the point…
      Flash can be as stable as the html if the application code is clean and bugs free! And Java for iPhone, iPod can be as dangerous as a virus for MSDOS if that is the target. It’s all about interest…

  • http://www.billigfergebillett.no Ferge Oslo K

    Since I do alot of programming I

  • http://Lillicotch.com Jim L

    There hasn’t been a more closed, more tightly controlled platform than Apple. Sometimes you need a system like that to first start and have the public accept a new technology. Once that happens I have found that open technologies will eventually catch and pass they closed ones.

    It’s happened before and looks like it’s already happened with the iPhone.

    • http://liveguitartutor.com Bob S.

      You are correct about Apple being a closed system, but you fail to mention, or perhaps didn’t know, that in the early to mid 90s (while Jobs had left), Apple began licensing out is Mac OS to clone makers. The most prominent of these was Power Computing. I for one was more than a little intrigued by the possibility of buying a Mac clone.

      It was this licensing that nearly killed the company, because Power Computing and others were building perfectly capable Mac-compatible machines. Don’t forget that Apple is as much as hardware maker as it is a software maker. Competition in the hardware industry is fierce and the margins are razor-thin. This new competition which had not existed before, meant huge losses for Apple, and was a major contributing factor to their near-demise. It was only when Jobs returned in 1996, axed upper management, and released the first iMac, that things started to turn around for Apple.

      Microsoft in its approach has never dabbled in building computers, only the OS to run them. So it has never had to worry about competition in the hardware industry. This is part of why MS has made soooo much $$$.

  • http://www.snerdey.com Snerdey

    Job’s must not have heard of the new Flash CMS Websites. They allow designers, owners to add keywords, descriptions to each page without the need for special software. It’s become one of our most popular products.

    He seams to be cherry picking apples and at the direction he’s going they’re going to turn rotten cause there’s a demand for flash. To me, he’s turning his back on those who seek it. Just another bad Apple..

    Have a Peachy Day!

    Follow me on Twitter.

  • http://www.tamevo.com Fouad Itani

    I personally believe that HTML5 will take over flash eventually. With big players such as Apple starting to abandon flash, soon sites will need to adjust and start using HTML5. Eventhough Hulu claims that it will not abandon Flash for HTML5, I think eventually they will. Once HTML5 and non-flash websites start surging.

  • Ron

    I agre with Janyer- Apple is going to far with this and being a Mac user AND web developer, am disappointed…

  • http://www.internetfreedommarketing.com Miles

    I could really care less. I love my mac and flash works on it. As far as the iphone goes I currently don’t have one, but would love to have one, however I will never use a phone for any major internet stuff. Why would I want to look at a little bitty screen when I can use a big screen on a laptop?

    I see cell phones as a convenient device for gps or navigation maps, etc. not for surfing the internet, as long as important things like maps and maybe a weather report work, Who Cares?

    It all boils down to marketing anyway, flash is becoming big in the area of advertising. If you wanna see more ADS on your iphone then force apple to use flash, like I said I don’t care.

  • http://www.247Generators.com Standby Generators

    I don’t care about the details. I want flash and that is it. Adobe and Apple you figure it out and get it to work. Give your customers what they want or you will lose them. It is that simple.

  • Guest

    Once again Jobs has taken a stance that only proves what an A$$ he is. He wants open platforms, but no ton his system.

    Remember when he threw a hissy-fit about IE installing without peoples knowledge when other apps were loaded? His software has done the same. But he thinks it OK.

    His overpriced and quality-lacking devices will never take over the world in a fair market, so he has to try to play God and make his own rules.

    He’s done a great job in growing Apple into a legitimate company again, but his methods run roughshod over anyone or anything that stands between him and world dominance. When the facts don’t support him, he twists the facts until they are no longer recognizable as the same information.

    Almost as if he is the Hitler of the computing world.

    • Guest

      well i would be the nazi of the computing world

  • http://www.merlinsltd.com John Burns

    Its true Apple has always been about making money first and the human side second.

  • http://www.pmtv2000.com Paul

    I honestly can’t see the point of developing something for years and then decide that it’s threatening the very platform that it should work on. You may as throw away your computers and buy a quill and a pigeon. Who wants an Apple product anyway, iPad … pantypad … status symbol ….

  • http://www.rockgigphotos.co.uk Bob Singleton

    I know from feedback from my own customers that they prefer a site that loads immediately rather than those that take minutes because the developer wants to show how cleaver he/she is by using a Flash intro. Personally, I’ve never liked Flash websites, and given the iPhone is a toy rather than a serious business tool, who gives a damn (apart from spotty 17 year olds) if you can use Flash on that! Get rid of Flash… it was never any good in the first place, and just messes up the web browsing experience for NORMAL users!

  • Robin Kanters

    I love Apple, I really do. I love their computers their iPhones, their iPods, their OS and software… But this really disappoints me. Steve, don’t be so paranoid… Flash on the iPhone will only allow software developers (like myself, though I’m a very young one: 16 years old) to create more rich content, and give customers yet another reason to buy an amazing phone, music player or tablet.

    I read Steve’s letter on the Apple homepage. And I must say, I will agree with some points. But for the most part, it is either bullshit or weak, what he writes. I also do not believe what he writes in his letter really is the reason for not allowing Flash to the iPhone. Adobe Flash CS5 compiles .swf’s to NATIVE .ipa’s (which are, of course, iPhone apps), so the only thing Apple has to do, is take a deep breathe, accept that it wasn’t a very wise choice, and ALLOW it.

    Also, in order for a developer to create or even TEST his app in Flash CS5, he/she has to be a (paying) member of the iPhone Developer Program. He/she has to install his/her certificate, create a provisioning profile and THEN you can deploy and test apps. So Apple doesn’t even lose money for allowing Flash created iPhone apps to the iPhone, it even increases it’s profit, as customers, as I’ve mentioned above, get yet another reason to buy an iPhone.

    I really hope Steve Jobs will read these comments, and reconsider Flash to the iPhone. Steve, we’re (almost) beggin’ you…

    Robin Kanters
    from the Netherlands

  • Chad Dornsife

    As an Apple user the programs that crash my browser routinely are something from Adobe.

    If they learn to play nice without causing harm, welcome, but why would anyone support products that cause grief for core Apple users if the name of your company is Apple.

    • Guest

      Thats because you use Crapple Apple. MS products never crash from Flash.. – Idgit

  • http://www.wygk.com Bob Nicholson

    Yes, people want to be able to access Flash-sites, but surveys have repeatedly shown that they actually don’t like Flash. Unfortunately, too many designers insist on using Flash to show off their skills or to charge more for development.

    Ultimately, html5 will allow developers to do everything they could do with Flash, but in a fully standards-compliant way.

    I think Apple has issued a wake-up call to web designers and developers: it’s time to let go of Flash and build truly open and accessible sites.

  • Guest

    As an Apple fanatic, I just want to say that I’m really sick of reading about all of the Apple hate. That company has given us some of the most incredible computers and gadgets EVER and they constantly get pissed on by PC lovers, and just about anyone else who finds amusement in bringing down whoever is at the top.

    Sorry folks, but Apple has EARNED their stripes.

    As for Adobe, Apple believed in them when they were nothing and now that company bites the hand that fed them. Last I checked, Apple belongs to Steve and if he feels that Adobe’s flash no longer works for his products, SO BE IT. Adobe can peddle their wares where they’re wanted and voila. Both companies get what they want. After all, I use Adobe’s Creative Suites and they’re an incredible company in their own right. They can get by without their “I love Apple” ads.

    And as for his “attack” and “essay”, when is it wrong to explain your point of view and/or reasons for why you’re taking a certain action? I seriously doubt Steve would have gone there at all if he didn’t feel a need to get it out in the open (and since none of us knows what’s gone on behind the scenes, none of us can say his reasons weren’t valid).

    Attacking him behind your internetz is really childish and petty. I’m firmly behind Apple, but not once did I say anything harsh about Adobe. That is called maturity. Try it sometime.

    • Guest

      Another Idgit

  • Guest

    Like it or loath it, flash is here to stay. Apple has always been a bit of a control freak. Even on the simple things like needing itunes to use an ipod etc (not allowing the user to WMP).

    The one thing that has always stopped me buying apple is that “our way or no way” mentality they portray. Accusing Adobe of closed systems must be some sick irony from them.

  • David

    First things first. HTML5 as a standard still DEPENDS on the matching functions installed in a browser, a browser of your choice to play. At some point it will have to tap into functions on your display hardware and software. HTML5 is not magically divorced from DEPENDENCIES on software and hardware integration on your platform, be it Windows or Mac.

    But HTML5 (some key patents still owned by Apple) is NOT a full-blown ANIMATION technology. So what if it can play movies IN BROWSERS EQUIPPED to display an encoded movie? How does a fixed movie file become vector-based animation? There is NO immediate substitute for the advanced capabilities of Flash….and I am not a Flash developer and have done my fair share of cursing at Adobe and Flash.

    But to suddenly release a major appliance to surf the web…and Steve Jobs introduced it publicly by touting it as a marvelous web surfer. Steve Jobs said the iPad was a revolutionary way to “experience” the web. So revolutionary that instead of going forward, Apple took two steps BACKWARDS by completely disabling the most ubiquitous display technology for web viewing of animated sites, animated graphics, and MOVIE viewing.

    If it had not been for the Flash technology Youtube.com would have never gotten off the ground and become such a hit.

    That Steve Jobs should come along and CRIPPLE the iPad and millions of websites that use Flash to a large degree or very small degree is egregious arrogance. Choose ME. Choose Apple. Screw you and the way you want to see or expect to see the internet.

    The iPad is missing a huge hole in its so-called leap forward technology.

    And it is disingenuous of Steve Jobs to claim that Flash saps the user experience on an iPad because it uses the battery too much.

    The REASON is that under Steve Jobs’ direction Apple has deliberately disdained to work with Adobe to write an iPad Flash version that harnessed the Apple chips in a more direct fashion.

    This is like the chairman of Mercedes introducing a new Benz as an incredible new way to experience driving on the interstate highway system– but you won’t be able to do this after DARK. They tested headlights but found they consumed too much power and just left them out. But, Happy Motoring everybody!

  • http://www.virginseye.com Adam Albrec

    I see Steve’s issues with flash clearly. It is a MASSIVE resource hog. Within just the last year, sites running flash (youtube, Comedy Central, Hulu, etc) were still playable, in low quality, on mid-level Apple systems 10-years old, but have since become almost unplayable in top-notch systems made just 4 years ago – all because of Flash 10.

    With the expansion of HD into flash, there is really no end in site, in terms of what is required to effectively run Flash without stuttering and audio-sync problems. This potentially raises the production costs dramatically for P.E.D.s and shortens their usable life.

    BUT, people don’t want to wait 10 years to watch their favorite shows on an airplane. Other manufacturers, however, are more than happy to make a unit that will only function for a year or so, make a little less profit on it – then sell the customer a newer version.

    Apple has always wanted to make high-end, art pieces that last. But how great is the sexiest phone or pad if it doesn’t do what you want it to?

    The last time Steve Jobs tried to shape the market and tell his customers what they ‘should’ want, he was fired from Apple and lost most of his street credit. Over time, as he was proven right by increasingly flakey PC performance, people came back to him, but does he have to be fired again to realize what Bill Gates learned in the 80’s – THE CUSTOMER IS ALWAYS RIGHT.

    Apple does best, and makes the most money when it does not attempt shape the market, but instead finds better ways to accomplish what people are demanding. In this case, it might be as simple as adding upgradeability to iPads and such (through hardware ad-ons, or maybe an upgrade service). The later approach would be superb in light of Apple’s alleged commitment to the environment.

  • Ron

    Steve Jobs think he is some kind of godly guru and have personal issues with adobe , that’s all it is in this new battle of apple vs adobe… the end will be one ! – Apple lost ! cause new mobile web devices will come in and will run Flash ! we already see the first from Google…

    no one can control the web ! Steve jobs, wake up from your kids dreams ! you are just a little kid ( grow up ! ) you are not the web god …

  • Scott

    This article is embarrassing for webpronews.com! REALLY? Don’t you guys have anything better to write about?

    Your article title/argument sounds more like democrats and republicans, get real …

    … like we have to choose one or the other

  • http://searchamelia.com tommylee

    The stand-off between Apple and Adobe is of no importance to innovation. People that call Jobs and Apple control freaks are simply living in denial about the one person that has shaped the landscape and is constantly raising the bar and thus asking Adobe to step up to the plate. Adobe has not done so for Apple and Apple is simply not willing to resort to the lowest common denominator in innovation which in this case would be Flash. HTML5 is the future and it is simply a matter of “why would you need an embed code to run the same content without having to use double resources”. Flash will always need to be “embedded” be it in html 4, or html 5 in the doctype declaration in any browser and as such Flash makes for using double resources.

    Those designers that are complaining that Apple is not supporting Flash on their mobile platform are as lazy as Adobe is to output functionality. If you doubt what is possible with HTML 5 and Java, you really should have a look at Jobs iPhone 4 introduction…. and no Flash.

    No matter how you twist an turn it HTML 5 is the future and if it does not require any embedding of code to function, Flash is obsolete in the mobile world. Flash will still have its place, somewhere, but not on the web.

    By the way I saw some remarks on Flash Advertising is “growing”. Well let me break your balls. Do some research because it is not. It is actually diminishing in favor of HTML5.

    I also see complaints about Apple being Money Hungry. Superior Productive and entertainment products prove to be in high demand even at a premium price. So why would a company that is operating in the market place to make money as a company and for their shareholders? Are you guys nuts? Buy a Kia if you don’t want to buy a Mercedes. Apple’s success is so overwhelming it is on its way to become the first Trillion dollar company. I can only cheer this on but most people are simply stupid enough to claim that Apple products are too expensive because they wish to buy it!

    Android. Well all flavors of Android together will at a certain point outpace the amount of iPhones in the US, because Globally I don’t really know. Why? Because competition is good and drives innovation. But how come that it is Apple each time that raises the bar end the rest has to scramble to keep up and can only produce inferior knock-off stuff that they can only sell at discounted rates. Is it wise for Android OS to support Flash? Maybe, until they come to realize that it is actually obsolete because why would you need to have a “translator” to translate from English into Spanish to then translate it back to English? Does that make any sense? No it does not and it introduces redundant steps that unavoidably lead to “translation” mistakes next to using unnecessary additional computational power.

    Are Apple and Steve Jobs Arrogant? Again maybe. But then again, Apple is not a Dell, nor a Microsoft or an HP or a Nokia. Apple is Apple Inc. and their decision to keep their OSX system closed is the reason why it is so productive in my hands and you bet i’m willing to pay a premium for my tools that make me money. I have colleagues that wield through “allow message” after allow/deny message to get to a web page (because they need the latest and safest anti-virus protections) have harddrive crashes more often than babies are born and spend hours on the phone to get “support”.

    p.s. There was an idiot that claimed that Mac would not be what it is today without Adobe’s Pagemaker back in 1986. Well do your research bozo. Pagemaker (Aldus Corporation) was BOUGHT by Adobe and so was FLASH and DREAMWEAVER (both Macromedia). Even the Stellar Program PhotoShop was not an Adobe invention but two brothers Thomas and John Knoll and the early name was Display, renamed to ImagePro sold with a couple of early scanners and renamed Barneyscan XP (bundled version) and was at first rejected by Adobe. Only persistence of John Knoll made the final adaptation into PhotoShop 1 by Adobe.

    This all to say that if the MACINTOSH hadn’t made its introduction in 1984 as such a revolutionary product you still would be typing DOS commands today and Adobe would be “Peeling Potatoes”. Think about that my friends.

    • Guest

      You must be able to type good documents – Idgit…

  • daniel

    I’m very glad to hear that flash one day can be out of the market. why? simply reason: it’s much better when people don’t need to install any plugin so if we can develop the same using html5 it’s just great. Other problem is: adobe flash is terrible greedy. I mean the memory use and related. And what about the security? flash is just perfect platform even for script kiddies to perform a very malicious attacks, adobe knows that and is doing nothing, every next version is still vulnerable and sometimes more than previous one.

  • http://www.worldtravelingartist.com/about Alexander

    … I never simpatised Apple, mainly because of their products high prices, and the most people I knew who were using Apple, were actually arrogant snobs.

    I think it’s no coincidence.

    AND there’s no way I will buy an iPod ever again. Bought it once for my ex gf and that piece of garbage brought nothing but trouble. In contrary of what I can say for my Samsung mp3 player that served me well a couple of years (I think it’s still working well, gave it to someone as a gift), had more storage, friendlier OS and navigation menu and was almost 3x cheaper.

  • http://www.worldtravelingartist.com/about Alexander

    Forgot to mention, flash is a piece of sh*t and should’ve never been brought on the market, especially not web market.

    • Guest

      yeah, of course it is, and so is apple and so is pc and so is everything around, sh*t, everywhere only sh*t, food is sh*t and clothes too, everything… u’d better forget to mention that… SHAME!

    • Guest

      Another Idgit….

  • James H

    As an user of macs for the past 18 years they are always my first choice of computers, but how dare Apple push away Adobe, because without them all them years ago when iPhone’s, iMacs etc were not invented, Apple relied solely on Adobe, as without Photoshop and Illustrator, and there use by us graphic designers (who kept Apple alive) there would be no Apple.

    And now to push them away is just an insult to Adobe.

    James H

  • Guest

    Apple doesn’t care about client’s demands and it’s not about batteries of course (iPad has enough room for much larger batteries, so the resources demands “excuse” might work for iPhone, with a shame for it while other devices work pretty well with it, but for iPad they need another “excuse”, and they found one, at least).
    Apple now reminds me Microsoft… of course, they have never been too much different in their greediness for the computer market control, they just had different styles and for a while I liked more Apple, but since I’ve got my 3gs, I started to love hackers and I’ll continue to give them credits and support, ‘cose I see it clearly now, Apple wants to put in jail the whole world! Steve, take some rest, man! You’ve done your job, you’ve killed MS. You’re a hero already, but it’s better to stop here and let people choose what soft to use on their own devices, which they have paid for!

  • http://www.ckfswebpagedesign.com Carol Swinehart

    Flash was first produced for presentations and not really meant for the web. HTML5 on the other hand is being developed with the web in mind. It is able to provide animation and all sorts of other interesting effects that will entertain as much or even more than Flash because it can be seen on all devices. I look forward to developing for HTML5.

    Someone had to tell Adobe they were not moving forward fast enough. Why not Apple.

    Having said that I am a big fan of many Adobe products and use them everyday.

  • Guest

    Flash is just too “dangerous” for Apple, which now tries to control software via iTunes just like they do with music and video… Flash can do almost anything with your apple device, just like its own OS, that’s the only problem! Jobs can’t control iPhone apps if flash will start to run any game…

  • Guest

    Flash is for those in the industry that don’t have the experience or knwoledge to produce videos otherwise. As for the Flash sites, try searching for a variety of products and see how many page 1 top 10 rankings come up with all Flash sites, almost none. Search engines can’t read through Flash, except maybe google ‘sometimes’, but what about all the others, and they do represent a lot of searches. Then there’s that stupid circle while flash is loading, who wants to watch something load?! Then there’s also the fact that if you don’t have the latest version you have to download and install it. PLEASE!!! A lot of people out there have trouble even opening their browser let alone installing software. Then you have these idiotic flash templates that use light type on a light background, you can’t read it, but it’s stylish and many flash designers only use templates.

    Build a site in Flash and it looks good, but nobody can find you on the net.
    No wonder Steve Jobs is fed up with it, so should everyone else.

    • http://cozumelmexico.net Bob Rodriguez

      Try putting in the search term Cozumel Mexico in Google or Yahoo. cozumelmexico.net is in a top spot. It has a flash intro. Flash isn’t dead. It is merely a toll. There is no single solution to making it to the top. The most important thing is RELEVENCY! Have fun!

      • Guest

        It sounds like the “we make you google No1″ advertisers.
        Who searches such a thing.
        Use common phrases to find the top ones.

        And a little intro on a plain text page doesn’t make a flash site.
        There could also be an animated gif – sry.

        And the site only proofs – event “microsoft word created” sites are found :)

      • http://www.mmortgage.com.au Guest

        With skill, you can get good indexing with a Flash Splash page site, but for what keyword phrase or which Page.
        Each webpage is a separate entity on the Web, so you may rank well for a deeper page, that does not have a splash page, which is a complete waste of your users time imo. Also back-links will help you rank well for keywords, even if your on-page SEO is crap. We have all seem this.
        Are you ranking for an obscure keyword, or a competitive one?

    • Guest

      It is the designers problem for rankings – Idgit…

  • http://www.LoftLivingLA.com Ted Trent

    I am not going to purchase any more Apple products that don’t have flash. FIX it boys and then you can have my business back. The IPAD is not all that, but when I realized it didn’t have Flash I’m like, SCREW THIS. PAY THEM WHAT THEY WANT.

    • http://www.mmortgage.com.au Guest

      Do you know what Flash is? Its a rich Internet application. Like Microsoft Silver Light.
      I lot of what you may think is “Flash” on the Web these days is actually Javascript applications using a javascript library to supply the code necessary to run it.
      Actionscript is Adobe’s version of this, but this is integrated with CS4/5, and allows you to build some great functionality into web applications.
      If you use WordPress or Drupal to build websites, which are free open source applications, they come with several Javascript libraries built in that have ready made solutions for this functionality.
      But to get back on topic, the recently released version of HTML, HTML5 and the new CSS, CSS3 will allow anyone to built rich internet actions, [down the road] without the need to buy expensive software, or for web users to have to download reader software that allows you to view these website applications.
      Flash imo, is a bad idea, that a lot of great web designers have used to build great RIAs with. HTM5 is the future, but people that make money by selling expensive software, and training courses for using this software will be out of business. MIcrosoft and Adobe may adapt their RIA products to stay relevant, That is what all the froth is really about. So Keep enjoying your iPad. It can only get better.

  • http://www.studio1c.com studio1c

    Why anyone would support Flash technology is befuddling to me. After all, it’s slow to load, isn’t SEO friendly (only recently has Google search engine been able to pull some info from it – what about Yahoo and Bing traffic?!!?), requires a separate download for Mac OR PC users in order to view it, has major accessibility issues (do blind people not matter?), lacks consistent cross-platform support as well as not being supported by the majority of 5 billion mobile phones (not just the iPhone folks).

    Flash has taken on a life of it’s own being used for entire websites, navigation and other uses that result in businesses calling me begging to redo their site in HTML because no one can find their site including search engines. There are so many other options… jQuery and Ajax which are SEO-friendly.

    Steve Jobs is a brilliant man that has made billions of dollars because of his Apple empire he created. Apple utilized Aldus PageMaker back in 1984 (acquired by Adobe in 1994) to help promote Apple as the predominant player in the desktop publishing field. If Adobe hadn’t created their creative suites, there were others at the time that Apple could have utilized. Adobe isn’t the only player – and personally I’m getting sick of having to shell out hundreds of dollars each year for their updates to their Creative Suite.

    • Guest


    • MJ

      Why? Because Flash is the #1 way to distribute video content on the web today. Hands down. #1. Get it?

      Screw Flash websites. Any decent developer knows it’s not for an entire site unless you’re MTV or some damn movie that’s coming out.

      Please Apple make Flash video playable.

  • Reconix

    I don’t understand how none of you.. Not one of you have yet to see this.

    There has been a huge demand for Flash on there devices. The end user pays a lot for what they get, Apple are way over priced, so how should they counter act that ? Make the system support high demand. In this case support some thing simple like Flash. It seems they just don’t have the support for flash, even with all there money.

    The device is lacking in hardware, a problem I’m starting to see. It’s not a case of security because I mean, yeah ok as mentioned in an earlier comment flash can be compromised by any little script kiddy but then again so can Java script and a hole manor of other Web Languages. Does that mean that they will be taking support for Java out or maybe even others ?

    It’s not a case of Adobe or Apple, it’s a case of Apple can’t even support Flash. It’s not a case of we don’t want to, it’s a case of we can’t.

    Apple should be listening more to it’s customers demands. If a few thousand people want some thing and are going to be paying for it.. You fricken well do it. We all know it can be done but Apple won’t admit that they can’t incorporate Flash.

    Hardware Problems ? – Some thing that should be worked on for the end user, they pay enough money don’t they ?

    Security Problems ? – There’s a way around every thing silly billys… where the hell have there secuirty guy gone lol.

    • http://www.mmortgage.com.au Guest

      Adobe CS4 and 5 runs on the iMac. Flash is part of that suite. They have versions for either PC or macs.
      The point is that with HTML5 you will no longer need to use Flash [Or MS Silverlight] to build RIAs. So save your money and the maintenance and upgrades and get with HTML5 and CSS3.
      As for Apple costing more that is no longer true. My last PC cost $2,200. The iMac I have cost $1545.
      Its better made, better designed, and works without breaking down all the time. According to Adobe, the iMac os requires half the memory to run its programs than PC microsoft.

      You mentioned your security man. That must be expensive, and a pc needs him because ms is built on an os that was cobbled together in the 1980’s, the macs OS is the same as used on Super Computers.
      Also your maintenance, keeping your software from falling apart is a MS and PC thing. If you thing your time has no value, keep mending your pc and software. Just keep a log of how much productivity you loose and time you waste.
      Finally on price I like the story about the old farmer wrangling for a better price for his horse feed, with salesman with a higher price.
      The salesman finally said. It depends on what quality you want. Do you want the price for oats before the horse has eaten them, or after it has eaten them.

  • PixelatedDwarf

    It would be wonderful if someone would set standards for the Web. Oh wait, that’s what W3 does – Like HTML5. Others are trying to force non standard alternatives on the general public – Like Both of the companies that are arguing right now. Flash is not a standard – without jumping through hoops it is not XHTML compliant out of the box. HTML5 is good but hasnt made the final cut yet and may go through more changes before it is ready for prime time. Hopefully they will go with a more open source alternative to the video standard (OOG anyone?).

    As a web designer it would be wonderful if there was one standard to follow and not jump through hoops so that things would display in all browsers correctly. Between Microsoft Exploder, Firefox, Chrome and Safari there are a lot of things that can go wrong with the best of pages when you talk about video and audio.

  • Flash is Good

    Flash is here to stay and if folks want to use html 5 and java script good luck on the learning curve and writing your own arrays. Adobe has security issues but so does Apple and Microsoft. I have not been an Apple basher before but, what can they really do you can’t do on a Microsoft OS?.
    Yes Jobs your Shit does stink……… You need to reconsider and if your Hardware is so closed it has trouble running Flash – that tells you something right there. Touch is not the way of the future SPEECH is anyway. Why are they pushing touch crap when SPEECH would be SO…. So… much better.

    How about the 1 reason not to use apple….

    1.] They don’t support FLASH..

    I am surprised they let you open PDF files.

    GO FLY a KITE APPLE…. Most Idgits use apple crap anyway.
    All your technology came from hard working people you would crap on in an instance….

    My opinion

    • http://www.mmortgage.com.au Guest

      Adobe and Flash will be around for ages.
      I used PC’s for 15 years and have switched to an iMac 18 months ago.
      Both have pros and cons, but my [wife’s] Apple does not break like the PC’s I have had. It is silent and takes far less room. The design is awesome.
      Its interesting to note that Adobe software requirements say you need twice the memory to run on a PC than they do on an iMac. Why is that? Check it out.
      Also hope you are keeping up with your virus scans and your maintenance of the software, cause I have forgotten whet that is.
      Why not keep a log of how much time you waste each year on these tasks.

  • leo

    silly? right.
    just buy an iphone or any other apple’s product.
    don’t care about any battle.
    love what you have.

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