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54 commentsTuesday, July 21, 2009

Who's Right: TechCrunch or Twitter?

@biz says "we absolutely did not give permission for these documents to be shared"

54 Comments

Familiarly such but I can

Familiarly such but I can not recollect where already read

TechCrunch has a point

On TechCrunch's receiving end, those documents - stolen or not - their simply news. They didn't do the hacking and if the documents weren't Twitter's it wouldn't cause so much controversy. After all, it's Twitter's fault it got hacked.

never change, people.

Another case of mob mentality/double standards in judging a case like this.

I wonder how many people would go on a witch hunt against techcrunch if the company affected was google, microsoft, apple, or even facebook, instead of their beloved twitter.

Stolen documents

Well, this is a good point. Why the documents were stolen?
In the Techcrunch case, they if in fact received stolen property, and it is a crime to possess stolen property. Let the law of land justify it.

Who's Right: TechCrunch or Twitter?

All this talk about stolen documents...who's right and who's wrong. There's too much finger-pointing both ways for me to say who's right (I wasn't there).

What I have not heard is whether Twiter has determined how the breach occured in the first place and what steps they plan to take to prevent this from hapening again in the future. As well, what were the nature of the documents - as Twitter user, has my privacy been violated?

stolen documents

Seems to me everybody fogot about the security issue, and no body is complaining about poor security or holes in security systems.

how were these documents stolen, and why ?

news is news, and there are many unethical methods used to obtain good, truthful news, but few are ever discussed or brought into the open.

We will need to see who complains, and where the complaints lead to, but boycots are not good for business, as you usualy shoot yourself in the foot when you boycot somebody for reasons that are not clearly explained, or if there is no real policy and expected results are not clear.

What is the reason for this sugested boycot, and what will be achieved ?

many people will be without their information distribution tools, and many others will not be reading valuable information, which may make their life a lot easier.

Loose, loose and loose again through boycots ?

or live with the hand that life has dealt you and make the best of your personal situation ...

you choose, and live with your decision.

Screw Twitter

Screw twitter, publish away. Shouldn't be keeping secrets anyway.

in 2 years time neither

in 2 years time neither Twitter nor TechCrush will be worth that much

Techcrunch is wrong

As most of the commenters here would say, I believe Techcrunch is wrong. Technically and legally, they may believe that they have some "newsworthy" things to say and so (believes) they had the right the publish it.

However, even though they think they had the permission from Twitter to publish it, unless they have written permission then their defence doesn't stand at all. Verbally, they had nothing unless they can prove it otherwise.

Ethically, they had no right to do it either. I'm sure if the tables were turned they would not like that to happen to them.

A few years ago, I was really looking forward to all the articles posted by Techcrunch. Lately, I haven't been as excited and the quality of the articles doesn't seem to be as good as it once was. Mashable seemed to be a better preference than them.

Not sure if this act by Techcrunch is an act of desperation.

Just my two cents.

Armand

What's the difference

between a 'leak' and a 'hack', either way source party did not grant it's release. I assume news organizations are no longer allowed to posses or published leaked documents?

I'm all for Tech Crunch and

I'm all for Tech Crunch and anyone else willing to publish the documents.

Sounds like there's an ulterior motive as to why Twitter is so desperate.

Nuance

A few points to bear in mind before burning Techcrunch:

1. Techcrunch seemed to be not the only one in possession of the documents. As always in news, if anyone published, the info is not secret anymore, so that'll have been some consideration for Techcrunch in publishing the documents.

2. There clearly seems to be have been some conversation between Techcrunch and Twitter, acknowledged by both. Only now, both disagree about what was agreed. Perhaps because Techcrunch had an oerly optimistic view on what was agreed, or the other way around, because Twitter initially thought they had no options and said 'Okay if you indeed leave out this and that', and now has a change of heart after deep consultations with the lawyers.

Hard for us to judge at this stage, but we'll probably hear more about it

Whose right: Techcrunch or Twitter.

I think a big point is being missed here.

These were stolen documents. Surely Techcrunch was committing an illegal act not by receiving them but receiving them, keeping them and distributing them. Isn't this called receiving stolen property.

If I received something that was stolen I would be charged with receiving stolen property.

Why should this be different.

Apart from that Had techcrunch got "written" permission to publish them. It is very easy to say someone at twitter gave permission. Why would Twitter be causing such a fuss if they had.

Seems illogical to me.

Should have been a no brainer

First, TC should have been sure and not lied about being given permission to give such information. I am sure they had some permissions, but not that kind of permission.

Should boycotting TC be a good retribution. Not really. In fact, hopefully TC will learn after this and go back to not getting into a bunch of wankage. For those who are disgusted, not visiting again might be the best solutions, but not always for everyone.

Will TC issue a retraction? Hopefully, but that will not solve all the people who probably saved all of the screenshots on their article and all the damage it has caused.

Common sense... seems to be something sorely lacking.

Difficult Decision

There's been a mixed bag of comments on this one and I'll reserve judgment for now. However, I don't agree that any personal information should be published without the owner's consent. With close to a million followers on Twitter, TechCrunch are walking on dangerous ground.

If the information included

If the information included social security numbers, would we be so quick to write it off?

It seems because we're on the internet, we forget that not all information is up for grabs. Hackers used to get caught, sentenced to jail and the terms of their probation included no access to computers.

Computer hacking is a huge concern in this country. What's to keep someone from attacking your confidential databases and releasing them? Or the databases of the payment systems you depend on, like ClickBank, 2CheckOut, PayPal or Google and releasing documentation which includes financial information on you and your clients.

Reporting that information was stolen is not wrong, but publishing the actual documents, just encourages more theft.

As it stands now, credit card companies and retailers pay millions in bribes every year to keep confidential lists from being released.

It's in everyone's self interest to shut this down.

Security

I advise the top governments companies and banks on Earth. From 1986 on I tell everyone to put all sensitive documents on computers with no network connections and no internet access, period. These companies are obviously not my clients. In addition, the philosophy of property consciousness in the world is primitive in my opinion. As I write these words is this a copyright? Do I own the words or word arrangements?

Copyrights are like patents in many ways. Of the 157 inventions of mine the world uses to enjoy their modern conveniences is there one even patent? Nope. I get them free from my creative business mind. I make money hand over fist and I allow the world to use them and make as much money as they like competing with the originator so that I can live a world with more wealth all around me. AND I never run out of ideas. Why should I be the only filthy rich bast--d around for miles. It's is better to give. When you register a patent in one country do the patent lawyer or some crooked clerk whisk it away to be sold in other countries?

That might not seem like a relative analogy but it is if you think about what words and ideas are. Do I own the words I use in the English Language? Should I pay my grade school teacher for use of the words I arrange on paper or otherwise on any medium? When my clients are hit by hackers running hacker software is it the hacker software developer to blame? Does everyone realize fundamentally that all walls, dams, boarders, banks, safes, building and so on are pure illusions and only temporary security and NATURE demands that all walls will crumble over time.

If you write it, it can and will be exposed. Whether that matters or not is another sorry story. What's the big deal anyway? Sincerely someone tell me what the big deal is?

Peace Out

Who's Right: TechCrunch or Twitter?

Of course Twitter is right and Arrington is wrong. Arrington has a history of doing stuff like this for self-promotion.

The interesting piece of this is that John Dvorak proved long ago that making an ass out of one's self can build page views. No doubt Arrington suffers from the same egomaniacal sickness and is willing to risk a lawsuit to drum up page views, ad clicks, or whatever it is that keeps his ego or bank account or both afloat.

Most of us consider ourselves more ethically bound than the likes of Arrington or Dvorak but I wonder if each of us has a price beyond which we'd sell out. I'd like to think I don't but until the situation arises I'll never be sure.

Twitter?

Because they decided to cry like bitches, I just deleted my Twitter account.

Why boycott TechCrunch? Those 'stolen' documents were news. It'd be like boycotting the NYT because it printed documents showing banks were stealing billions of dollars. The source doesn't matter with news, as long as it's legit.

Whether it's ethicial or not

Whether it's ethicial or not is besides the point. It's illegal to possess stolen goods. And since it crossed state lines, it is actually a violation of federal law. The FBI needs to step in and arrest those responsible.

you're an idiot. A news

you're an idiot. A news publication is not responsible in any way to withhold or not accept items that may be new worthy regardless of their origin. Maybe you should know the laws before you start talking about them...

So news organizations are

So news organizations are exempt from the law for possessing stolen goods if it makes a good story? WTF are you smoking?

Sir. look up for instance

Sir. look up for instance Bartnicki v. Vopper. Wiki it if you need to. It was about an Illegal recording of a conversation that violated the ECPA. The court found that a news organization could play the tape if it was found to be news worthy and that they could not be held responsible for the third party who obtained the Illegal and stolen recording. There is tons and tons of case law for this situation.

So that sir is wtf I'm smoking.

That is a good point.

That is a good point. However, in that case it was just that the wiretaps were illegal. Nothing was stolen, so it's not possession of stolen property. In the Techcrunch case, they acutally received stolen property, and just the possession of stolen property is a crime. Now, if they had just reported the break-in with some details told to them by the hacker, then I'd say that they're OK. They're just reporting news about something that happened that was illegal, and you'd be right, they can't be held liable. However, they took receipt of property that they knew to be stolen. That's a crime.

A broadcaster cannot be held

A broadcaster cannot be held civilly liable for publishing documents or tapes illegally procured by a third-party.

If this can happen to

If this can happen to Twitter, it can happen to anybody especially content producers. TechCrunch did this on purpose--self-promotion as they're hungry for publicity and Twitter with such massive following is a great target to get huge traffic and buzz. It's becoming a scary (internet) world when your valuable information can be stolen and get publicised without your consent. And with this incident, I even doubted if every single post on TechCrunch aren't stolen. Come on, read between the lines,
"...a few of the documents have so much news value that we think it’s appropriate to publish them"
Whether the information is "STOLEN or ILLEGAL" as long as it can create BUZZ, it's ethical? Well, this is the game online, the new trend as they say technology trends that steal and walkaway and whoever gets hurt and compromised are weak and pityful. Is this how BUZZ hungry the internet sites are now?! I think so and I will not be surprised if one time there would be war on cyberspace. This issue will just fade anyway among the dust of yesterday, sorry Twitter coz you're vulnerable and they are strong. You loose...they gain...that's life and it sucks sometimes!

I think you're Right!

Yes, I think part of it was the Green
Eyed Jealousy monster, how sad &
unprofessional...
I believe in Cosmic justice still,
so Tech Crunch better watch out for
the backlash....

The good old days of the web is gone

Once upon a time, Internet time wise- there was a highly regarded thing called netiquette, and every newcomer to the to the Word Wide Web was told to understand this unenforceable law.

Far gone by now. Decency and netiquette is not really in the buzz.Being firts with the worst is the self promoting thing of the day.
Fact of life? Yes, but sad nevertheless!

In short - they were wrong to publish stolen docs.
IMHO, that is.

Cheers!
/Petit

tech crunch

I say boycott the sillies who has decided to boycott techcrunch - short memories they have or what TC has been bigging up twitter for months - one less than holy story and your true colors show. turncoats!

You're a moron.

You're a moron.

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