Kirk Cameron Talks Celebrities and ‘Mercy Rule’

By: Kimberly Ripley - August 24, 2014

Kirk Cameron, former Growing Pains star and evangelist, spoke recently about Hollywood celebrities and how they should be held to a higher standard. The brother of Full House star Candace Cameron Bure, Cameron is no stranger to the Hollywood scene, and these days uses his talent, notoriety, and his connections to make films that are quite a bit different from the current Hollywood standard.

“The films that I make…are really about themes that I think resonate in people’s heart, at least they do in my own family. So I’m always going to make movies that I believe in, that I can give 100 percent to, that I think are going to be offering people something good,” he said.

Kirk Cameron has recently seen one of his new films come to fruition. Mercy Rule was made for home viewing and became available at Walmart just a couple of weeks ago.

“My wife and I are always looking for a great new movie to watch on movie night and it’s hard to find films that are fun and inspiring and that are going to build up our faith in God and our strength as a family,” Cameron said. “So we decided we would make one and we made it right here in our own backyard with a local little league team and it’s a movie where family learn the lessons of mercy, patience, sacrifice and trusting God.”

Kirk Cameron strongly urges celebrities to adhere to a higher standard.

“With the privilege of a platform comes great responsibility … [We’ve] got to be careful with what we say and how we say it and everything should be seasoned with grace and while I certainly I don’t do that perfectly, I strive to do it increasingly,” he explains.

Making Mercy Rule is just one of the ways he appears to be adhering to that higher standard himself. Kirk Cameron won’t produce or appear in a film that isn’t suitable for viewing by the whole family.

Do you expect other Hollywood celebrities will step up and adhere to the higher standard that the former Growing Pains star believes is so important? Do you feel that celebrities should use the privilege of their platform for way more good than simply that of the current Hollywood standard?

Kimberly Ripley

About the Author

Kimberly RipleyKimberly Ripley is a freelance writer and published author from Portsmouth, New Hampshire. A wife, mom of five and 'Nana' to Lilly and Aiden, she loves cooking for her big family and watching HGTV in her spare time. Kim is guilty of starting way more home design projects than she can finish. Visit her at Twitter and Facebook.

View all posts by Kimberly Ripley
  • Nikki Noffsinger

    The Blind Side called and they want their movie back. I know that sounds just really bad and makes me look like a bully or something but I just cannot and will not support someone who knowingly hurts other people with his beliefs. WE all have a place in this world and rights in this country and everyone should be respected.

    • Marley

      I don’t understand how he is hurting others with his beliefs. I’m sorry you see him this way. I see is a hard-working, loving Christian man who wants to reach others who are searching for a love only God can give them. Nothing wrong with that. I think he would say he respects your beliefs and your right to believe the way you do, just as I will say the same to you.

      • Nikki Noffsinger

        I just don’t like some of his views on certain subjects Marley. I try to respect everyone and I believe everyone deserves their place in the world. I am not godless nor do I not have faith or peace. I was raised in a Godly home-a Southern Pentecostal home at that. I attended a private school for most of my schooling. I just don’t care for some of Kirk’s comments but I’m sure there are plenty of mine or someone else’s he doesn’t care for. I don’t discriminate against people and sometimes I think Kirk does a little bit. He gave a speech or interview some time back against how Christianity is the only God religion out there and that’s not true.

        • yobamajokes

          Nikki – imho, you are simply grasping at straws, it is not Kirk you have the problem with, but rather, it is God.

          • Nikki Noffsinger

            I have no problem with God at all. I love God and his son Jesus Christ. I am against anyone that would cause harm to another by action, thought, or by actions.

        • laura0109

          Everybody believes the God of their religion is the only ‘real’ God…otherwise they would switch religions. I disagree with a lot of Kirk’s beliefs; but they are his, not mine, and I’m still not sure how he’s hurting anyone.

        • dusty

          I wish Christianity weren’t the only way to Jesus. If all roads lead to God, then all those Christians in Northern Iraq had their heads cut off today for no reason. All roads lead to God is an american thing. The rest of the world disagrees. So did Jesus, “No one gets to the Father except by me.” Man, I wish He hadn’t said that. Tough stuff.

          • Nikki Noffsinger

            I once asked my grandpa if Catholics, Jews, and others got to heaven and he told me, “Well of course they get to heaven. God ends up in the mix one way or another so if they are faithful and follow what the Bible tells us then of course they go to heaven.” Now not all preachers will say that. I have heard some preachers say that the only belief is the Christian belief and that anything is the worship of false Gods or idols. I think that is rubbish.

      • Scott Johnson

        Besides the millions of people who have been killed in the name of God, we’ve got women losing access to healthcare, gays still not being afforded equal rights, children not being vaccinated, and thousands of other ways that “personal” beliefs are holding our society back. If you don’t see the harm in Christianity, you are living with your eyes closed.

        • Jen623

          Omg, whatever. God always gets the blame.

          • Mike

            If your God exists, infinitely powerful and knowledgeable, then every event from the smalles to the largest is directly attributable to him/her/it.

        • Fat Flounder Face

          Let’s talk about the millions killed in the name of “no god” under Mao, Stalin and Pol Pot. People kill people and sometimes they use any excuse. You do realize that you have Christianity to thank for ending slavery, giving women the vote, modern society, Western culture, the concept of the equality of all men and women, etc, right? Jesus taught that men and women were equal and that all men were created equal. It seems you really need to get an education in modern thought and you’d be surprised at how much of the philosophy of the enlightenment actually were concepts that Jesus specifically taught.

          • https://www.twitter.com/ElysiaValentine ElysiaValentine

            LOL^^^

          • Nikki Noffsinger

            There was a whole Holocaust because of twisted views on religion, innocent people burned at stakes in Salem, and innocent people including children during the Crusades and Spanish Inquisition.

          • Mike

            This is a typical christian claim but it is the result of either ignorance or dishonesty.

            Political extremists who happen to be atheists (because they don’t want anything to distract from loyalty to the state) have killed a lot of people but it was never in the name of or for the cause of atheism. Many religious people have killed millions expressly for religious purposes. That is the factual difference that christians, in their revisionism, don’t care for.

            Here is another example of revisionism… “You do realize that you have Christianity to thank for ending slavery,
            giving women the vote, modern society, Western culture, the concept of
            the equality of all men and women, etc, right?” No. Christianity expressly allows for slavery. it’s in the Bible. Christians of the middle 19th century gave many arguments against freeing the slaves that sound remarkably similar to the anti-freedom of christians regarding medical care for women and marriage equality today. Western culture, had it roots in Greece and Rome and developed from there. Religion was very dominant in that process for a while but the enlightenment put an end to that and modern culture is based on enlightenment ideals, which stand directly opposed to the teachings of christianity.

            Learn something before you speak.

        • laura0109

          how are woman losing access to healthare in the name of God? How are children not being vaccinated in the name of God? How are ANY of these things God’s fault? People are stupid and twisted and use God…don’t blame God for that. He gave these morons the vaccines…if they are too dumb to use them…..OYE!

          • Mike

            The religiously based fools who do everything they can to deny women abortion services because of deeply stupid ideas about an brainless embryo being a human being. That’s how women are being denied health care.

          • laura0109

            When you’re pregnant, you’re not actually ‘sick’…but to address your point, the supreme court has ruled abortion is legal. END OF STORY! Obviously you’re not familiar with how our country works. If you were, you wouldn’t such a patsy to the left who have you thinking if you don’t vote democrat, woman everywhere will be having abortions in back alleys and bleeding to death! They are suckering you, and everyone as ignorant as you to vote for them! 1) it’s next to impossible to reverse a Supreme Court decision. Think of how many anti-abortion presidents we’ve had in the last 30 years? They’ve held the WH the majority of the time, and yet abortion is still legal. Why? Because they can’t change it! 2) FYI, surgical abortions are WAAAAY down in this country, but abortions are not. That’s because woman now have abortions at home, with a pill. If by some small miracle, abortion became illegal in this country again, it wouldn’t stop abortions! As long as woman can buy pills from outside the US over the Internet, abortions will continue. Both the republicans and the democrats use the abortion issue to get votes. So many ignorant people fall for it and actually base their vote on it! Wake up!

          • laura0109

            Oh, and FYI…brain development begins in the first week the egg is implanted in the uterine wall…..

    • Lorie Mayfield

      @Nikki I agree with your point that we all have a place in this world and rights in this country where everyone should be respected that is very true. I happen to hold a biblical worldview and agree with Kirk Cameron, my question is how does my/our beliefs knowingly hurt people? This is a believe that we have that is found within the Bible. People are free to accept or reject the belief, to watch or not watch a movie. i loved the blind side and watch the Ravens just to see Oher play, however I like Mercy Rule and many of Kirk Cameron’s movies. Kirk and Chelsea are Christians and they hold certain believes just as many other Christians do. I’m sorry if someone miss used the gospel towards you and hurt you in any way. That is not God, that is people and we are not perfect God is love and loves all, however He is holy and has a way that we are to conduct ourselves and its found in the Bible. What I see is people who are hurting and try drugs, alcohol and many other harmful things to fill something that only God can fill. I hope that you find your peace and feel the love of God. Be blessed.

      • Nikki Noffsinger

        Speaking as a granddaughter from a Southern Pentecostal preacher and raised in a Christian home, my grandpa always taught and instructed us to spread God’s word the way Jesus was instructed-with love. Too many times some people get so caught up in their religion that they beat down people with it instead of doing as Jesus instructed his 12 disciples to do in the Upper Room. I have no fault with Kirk other than some of his comments have rubbed me the wrong way. My grandpa did not believe in homosexuality but BUT he never treated anyone badly because of it. He worked with all kinds of people from all types of faiths and walks of life and he never once shunned anyone. He stated how he believed but he did it in such a way that he didn’t leave out one of the most important aspects-“Love thy neighbor.”

        • Fat Flounder Face

          Can you give a specific example where Kirk Cameron EVER shunned anyone, let alone a gay person? Kirk Cameron is a walking example of what a Christian should be. He doesn’t speak out against much of anything and instead promotes what is positive. It seems you simply hate all Christians, instead of those that are 95% of church people who would kill Jesus all over again. You are the textbook definition of a bigot.

          • Nikki Noffsinger

            Yes actually it was about a year ago when he was promoting a documentary and the reporter asked him about gay marriage. It wasn’t that he didn’t believe in it that bothered me it was that he had to blame gays for the breakdown of society. It was a CNN interview I believe.

          • laura0109

            I saw that interview. It seemed like he was trying to find a secular reason for being against gay marriage and couldn’t quite come up with one.

          • Nikki Noffsinger

            That is how I felt.

      • Mike

        If you, like Mr. Cameron and so many other self-identified christians advocate discrimination against homosexuals, lying to children by replacing science with christian mythology in public school classrooms, and trying to control the medical care available to women based on faith based (rather then fact based) ideas then yes, you are doing direct harm, just like Mr. Cameron. He is a deeply immoral person and so is anyone that agrees with him.

        • Lorie Mayfield

          Thank you for responding to my post, I would like to address each point as they were made. I don’t advocate discrimination of anyone. I do however believe that homosexuality is a sin based on my believe, however I also believe that sex outside of marriage is a sin as well. I believe that marriage is between a man and a woman and based on my faith and my belief that is based on the Bible then it is wrong. The next point you make is replacing science with a myth. There is the theory of evolution and the theory of creation. I happen to believe in the theory of creation. If you want to believe that you evolved from a monkey then you are welcome to believe that theory. I would like to say that I believe in free will and choice, I however believe that God is the giver of all life and that life begins before conception, and we don’t have the right to end that life. As a Christian woman and a former person who has worked in labor and delivery department and helped with the delivery of a 17 week old fetus (miscarriage) and had to take hand prints, foot prints, clean and present this infant to the mother so she could say goodbye to her child and hold the baby, it is not a blob of flesh or nothing. If you ask any woman who has miscarried a child if it was nothing then sir you are incorrect. When I witness a person having their 4 abortion and having 5 children then that does cause me to pause. However I still believe in free choice and free will. I just happen to be pro-life. I don’t apologize for being a Christian or my beliefs, just as you shouldn’t apologize for yours. I do have a point for someone who dislikes Christianity so much you sure have a lot to say about the contents found within the Bible which is a book written for Christians. I mean I don’t read the Satanic Bible by Anton Lavey and say why I don’t believe this part or that part. I don’t go to other sacred text followed by other worshipers of other religions because those are their text. Sir I don’t have to prove the Bible because it’s actually happening today things that were written over 2000 years ago. You don’t have to belief in the God I serve but I do. I love the Lord because he heard my cry and lifted me out of my distress and healed my of all my afflictions. He is awesome and I serve him gladly I don’t apologize for that and I am not ashamed. Be blessed.

    • Jerry

      Nikki, you are hurting me with your beliefs and opinions.

      • Nikki Noffsinger

        They sell band aids at Wal Mart.

      • Mike

        No, he isn’t. What you weak, entitled christians need to learn is that telling someone they are wrong is not hurting them. Telling people that they can’t make their own medical decisions is hurting them. Telling them they can’t marry the partner of their choice is hurting them. Screaming and whining for laws allowing a privileged minority to discriminate against an innocent minority is hurting them.

    • Jen623

      He’s not hurting anybody with his beliefs…only those with a guilty conscience maybe?

      • Nikki Noffsinger

        I have been married to a man for over 20 years and have 2 children. I am not guilty about anything. I just do not agree with some of his ideology.

      • Mike

        Of course he is hurting people. He speaks out against the equal protection under the law for people he doesn’t like and advocates lying to children in public schools by substituting moronic christian mythology for actual science.

    • girlfromnorthcountry

      It looks like our beliefs as Christians are the only ones not tolerated. How does that go down with all of the “tolerate everyone’s beliefs” people. When someone else’s beliefs are questioned there’s an uproar, protests, yahoo bit all over the internet-but nothing when it’s our beliefs questioned. Not equal, just think it’s worth saying.

      • Nikki Noffsinger

        If your belief is hurtful to someone else then no I cannot tolerate your kind of Christianity.

      • Mike

        Please don’t be ridiculous. In a country with 450,000 churches and a
        population of 313.9 million, christians are not tolerated? In a nation
        where no President has every been elected without professing
        christianity, christians are not tolerated? In a nation where right wing
        christian zealots are able to pass immoral laws controlling women’s
        right to medical care and allowing them to discriminate against people they don’t like, christians are not tolerated? This is a deeply idiotic claim.

        Christians are slowly, glacially, loosing their privileged
        status (as is right) and every special privilege they loose and every
        one of the traditional discriminations they have imposed are thrown out, they howl that they aren’t being tolerated. How pathetic and entitled.

  • blueyedlorelie

    I wish the world were more merciful, patient, self-sacrificing and tolerant of different points of view, but it isn’t. We have to look for the light as best we can and understand the darkness.

    • Mike

      I agree. All these christian bigots need to learn that they are what is wrong with this country and start acting with a little less hatred and deception.

  • Darkside97Michael Bushnell

    What an absolute j’d off twit.

    • Jen623

      Jealous much?

      • Mike

        I am not (and I doubt the other poster is) jealous of Mr. Cameron. He is in fact pitifully blind, living in his silly, demon haunted little world never able to face reality.

  • Deqwanne Jackson

    HE’S A TOTAL IDIOT.

    • Jen623

      He’s right tho…and it bothers you doesn’t it?

      • Mike

        He is not right. His stances on creationism are outright lies. They contradict established science and well documented facts. His efforts to supplant real science in schools with christian mythology is reprehensible. The greatest crime is that he encourages invalid ways of thinking, magical thinking instead of rational. That is a grave, shameful disservice, especially to kids.

  • Lisa Gladigan

    I think he is a good and honest man, but I don’t agree with some of his beliefs. Like his stance on homosexuality and creationisim.

    • Nikki Noffsinger

      Same here Lisa.

    • Jen623

      His beliefs coincide with God. Can’t have it both ways.

      • David

        well, time to drop God then. besides, there are other more inspiring, and humane, pieces of fiction.

  • mew

    Now he is the forerunner of the Antichrist!!!

    • Russell Powell

      I am thankful that he is making movies my family can enjoy.God bless you Kirk.Keep standing for truth.

      • Jen623

        Well, SOMEBODY has to!!

        • David

          nah, no one has to. unless, that’s in the Bible?

  • girlfromnorthcountry

    It looks like our beliefs as Christians are the only ones not tolerated. How does that go down with all of the “tolerate everyone’s beliefs” people. When someone else’s beliefs are questioned there’s an uproar, protests, yahoo bit all over the internet-but nothing when it’s our beliefs questioned. Not equal, just think it’s worth saying.

    • Mike

      Please don’t be ridiculous. In a country with 450,000 churches and a population of 313.9 million, christians are not tolerated? In a nation where no President has every been elected without professing christianity, christians are not tolerated? In a nation where right wing christian zealots are able to pass immoral laws controlling women’s right to medical care and allowing them to discriminate against people they don’t like, christians are not tolerated? This is a deeply idiotic claim.

      Christians are slowly, glacially, loosing their privileged status (as is right) and every special privilege they loose and every one of the traditional discriminations they have imposed are thrown out, they howl that they aren’t being tolerated. How pathetic and entitled.

  • Gail

    I have never heard him say anything that hurts anyone. I don’t get it- If you don’t believe the way I do- that is your right. But if I don’t believe the way you do, I am intolerant, bigoted and narrow minded. I believe what the bible says – period.
    And I believe following Christ is the only way to Heaven. He actually said so.
    And you know what if you don’t agree fine- that is your right. I know where I am going.

    • Mike

      Then you haven’t listened/ he has openly advocated denying free and equal protection under the law to Americans he doesn’t like and supports lying to children in science classrooms. He is a very bad person and so is anyone who agrees with him.

  • Meg

    Rock on Kirk! I am so thankful for a Christian that is a follower and stands a firm on that! There aren’t sway’s or compromises that you make in your work and I am so thankful. I will also say that everything I have EVER read regarding your views, follow biblical principals. Thank you for listening for GODS lead in your life and thank you for living for him and not for PLEASING others! Looking forward to this movie!

    • Brian Young

      It’s amazing how ppl hate truth. I agree with Kirk. We all “especially celebrities” need to stop & ask ourselves at the end of the day, are we leading ppl to Christ with our words & actions or to the devil? There’s no in between!! We all will b held accountable.

      • Brian Young

        Preach on Meg!!

      • Mike

        What we need to ask is “Are we telling the truth and not hurting other people?” This clown is opposed to equal protection under the law for all Americans, having spoken out against marriage equality; and supports lying to children by putting christian myth rather then scientific fact in classrooms. He is a bad person who callously hurts others while self-righteously believing in his own goodness. He and peopl elike him have no moral compass and no clear conception of reality and should be shamed and ignored, not lauded.

  • Steve

    Kirk Cameron is repulsed by the so-called “gay lifestyle” and uses his interpretation of the scripture as a vehicle for his intolerance. He can believe absolutely anything he wants.. he can worship a tractor for all I care. But what he clearly doesn’t realize (as rest of the Evangelicals) is that intolerance, even used under the guise of religion, hurts and continues to perpetuate violence and hatred against the people he preaches against. Something is just inherently evil about that and if there is a god, I doubt he would approve.

    • Jen623

      “Interpretation of the scripture” Ignorance is bliss isn’t it , uh “Steve”?

    • Fat Flounder Face

      Interpretation of scripture? I just love religion deniers. Believe what you want about homosexuality, as a libertarian conservative I really don’t care what they do in the privacy of their homes. However, trying to say that the Bible isn’t clear on the issue is just plain ignorant. You are simply intolerant of his beliefs. He isn’t hurting anyone, leave the guy alone and let him make his movies. If you don’t like him, don’t watch them.

      • Mike

        It is irrelevant what the Bible says. It is a book of myths significant only in that a lot of fools think it is real.

        • Prometheus

          If you are an activist seeking recognition and acceptance from religious institutions, then the scriptures of those institutions are absolutely relevant … whether Mike believes them or not. It’s the first and most important right in the Bill of Rights. It was so important the framers made it first, even before the freedom of speech. We have the freedom to exercise our faiths … even if that faith is Satanism. It’s all protected under the Constitution.

          I feel bad for you Mike, I really do … because your attempts to insulate yourself and judge everyone you see as intellectually inferior are so lacking. You must be a truly miserable person. I’ll bet you can’t drive from home to work without swearing at someone on the road.

          Faith is a powerful thing for those that believe. You aren’t the judge of what is right or moral or proper. And if you’d like a more secular-oriented scope of the discussion of faith, so you can start to approach the level of intellectual discussion you seem to think yourself prepared for, you should read DesCartes’ Meditation III. He applies his own methods of Doubt and Analysis to the question to uncover where the compass of the discussion points. It’s pretty interesting, especially if you want to approach it from an Atheist view.

          • Mike

            An activist? No. I just point out foolish lies when I see them in open, public forums. You are persisting in your foolish misinterpretation of the First Amendment. You can practice your religion in private. The government can’t support it and that means an individual acting in capacity for the government either. It such a simple thing that you conservative christians seem to be incapable of seeing.

            Your feelings are of vast unconcern to me. What is of concern that you and others like you are determined to illegally push your religion onto others. Stop doing that and we’ll get along fine. I am not miserable; you should stop entertaining the conceit that you and what you support are so inherently good that opposition to them equals misery.

            Faith is a powerful thing but what I have never gotten a decent answer for is why it is a good thing? Why is accepting proposition without evidence a good thing?

            In any case, I am a judge of morality, as is every human being. I am just a lot better at it then people who use an archaic books of myths for their guide and that seems to piss them off.

            I am quite familiar with Descartes. You should do a bit of reading on the cartesian circle in regards to it. His arguments in the third meditation are circular.

          • Prometheus

            When I said “activist” I was referencing the story and the voice of criticism in this case. Try to follow the bouncing ball. This is all in reference to the story above, remember?

            I’m not interpreting the First Amendment, I’m reading it … you should try it sometime. Here it is:

            “Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.”

            Tell me where it says “in private.” Tell me the SCOTUS decision that says religious views may only be recognized or expressed in private.

            I’m not illegally doing anything. And I’m not pushing my views on anyone. I merely expressed my views. I also reserve the right to raise my children to believe as I do. You should stop forecasting your own provocations on others and remember that you are the one arguing for the illegality of thought, not me. I don’t care if schools teach evolutionary theory … I have been very consistent about that. It doesn’t bother me. It also doesn’t change my views, because I have taken the time to learn about evolutionary theory in a way it seems you haven’t. I have actually read the secular criticism as well, and there’s plenty of it.

            And you aren’t a judge of anything. Your delusions of self appointed grandeur entitle you to no more weight in a discussion than anyone else. You keep citing legal trespasses that aren’t trespasses. You keep telling me I don’t understand the First Amendment, but all of your opinions about it are ancillary to what it actually says. Go ahead … read it.

            No matter what you think about faith, it doesn’t entitle you to tell me I’m wrong. You don’t know that there isn’t a God (much to DesCartes’ point). You think there isn’t a God. As much as you think me a mental inferior for believing in a God based on “archaic books and myths,” you believe there isn’t one with much less to support your opinion.

            I get it if you’re angry with religion … I’ve been there. But your perceived slights at the hands of some amorphous crowd of believers isn’t my fault. If I have committed some kind of evil, as you have suggested multiple times, please tell me what it is. Your whole regimen is based on your personal hatred of religion … but that doesn’t change anyone’s thinking, because it’s just personal spite. You offer nothing but cynicism.

          • Mike

            You misused the word. Accept it. I am not an activist. I just post things on forums when people like you make mistakes.

            You are reading the amendment incorrectly as every legal interpretation has shown. The government may not advocate for any given religion and individuals acting in official capacity on behalf of a governmental body may not do so. Tell me where it says the government may push a single religion.

            You are advocating illegal things, such as the teaching of religion in public schools. You can raise your children how you like, of course, but you are doing them a grave disservice; just as you are doing yourself one when you reject fact for fantasy.

            I am a judge. Everyone is. You just don’t like it that you have been found wanting. I have explained to you, for instance, why you are wrong about the first amendment. You are too ignorant and arrogant to accept the facts. thank goodness that harms only you and your children.

            I can in fact tell you that you are wrong when you demonstrably are. There is no evidence to support your religion (I bet you think there is and that along with you thinking that there is no evidence for evolution clearly shows that you don’t know what evidence is) religion or any other. Present some and I will accept it. Also, the bible is an archaic book of myths. It describes a world wide flood that we know didn’t happen, gives an account of a six day creation that we know didn’t happen, and on and on. How else can it be described?

            This is so utterly typical of the arrogance and ignorance of christians. I have no problem with religion in general, as long as you don’t push for it’s illegal inclusion in my government. People like you, so drunk with the false idea of your own purity, can’t conceive that they are hurting society and deserve to be reprimanded. I am not angry at religion, I am angry with people like you who use their religion as an excuse for their bad behavior. That isn’t cynicism. It is a hopeful idea that imagines a world where the evils of minority religious zealots like you are no more. Not religion, just your kind of arrogant, intrusive religion.

            I note without surprise that you fail to comment on DesCarte again. Were you unaware of the criticisms of the third meditation?

          • Prometheus

            Wow Mike, you do know how to ramble don’t you. I never said government should advocate a specific religion, I said government can’t prevent its citizens from doing so. If you can’t tell the difference, then I can’t help you.

            Your not understanding of words’ meanings is not the same thing as others misusing them.

            Go ahead and tell me how I’m misreading the First Amendment again.

    • Prometheus

      The Bible says homosexuality is a sin. It doesn’t say gays can’t go to Heaven, but to obtain salvation you have to accept Christ and his death and resurrection. You can’t continue to live a life mired in intentional sin and be saved. It’s not a matter of intolerance, it’s what the scriptures say. You also can’t continually cheat on your wife, or assault people, or lie. All of those acts require an admission of sin and request for forgiveness.

      Where homosexuals seem to struggle is in the definition of sin. Just because you feel like the “love” you want is right doesn’t mean it is. NAMBLA exists to present the same argument, and I’ll be willing to venture that you won’t support their claim.

      Recognizing sin for what it is isn’t intolerance. The scriptures set a very clear path to salvation. The scriptures also say not to be consumed by the world’s passions and sin, and not to adopt it for yourself. It says not just to go out and make disciples, but to also set yourself apart, so as to not be led astray.

      In the end, the homosexual activism of our modern age is all about gaining legitimacy and recognition, primarily from religious authorities. There is a constant stream of statements coming from that lobby demanding recognition from churches, marriage, funerals, and so on. The scriptures haven’t changed. If anything, the more archaeologists find of ancient texts, the more our translations are confirmed. That was the result of the Dead Sea Scrolls. You want homosexuality to be legal and not be a sin, but you can only have one of those, because one is determined by men/women, and the other by God, and God’s Word hasn’t changed.

      When did tolerance come to mean everyone agrees with Steve?

      • Mike

        Tolerance doesn’t mean that. It does mean, for instance, that comparing adult homosexuals to pedophiles is wrong. It means that you can’t, as you do, say that someone else’s “love” (your sarcastic quotes repeated for emphasis) isn’t good enough.

        The fight for rights for homosexuals is not about gaining the approval of religious leaders. it is about stopping religious leaders from using the law to push their intolerance and hatred.

        It is an interesting side mote that you people seem to think that you are good and moral because you follow the Bible yet it has led you into clearlu immoral activity.

        • Prometheus

          I didn’t compare homosexuals to pedophiles, I compared the argument of one group who’s behavior is alternative to an established societal norm (a norm that is changing) to another group who’s behavior continues to be alternative to established societal norms. How about it I compare the quest for homosexuals to marry to the quest for some religious minorities to marry multiple partners? Or to people who want to marry animals? These are all parallel arguments that you shouldn’t judge someone for who (or what) they love and that love is love no matter who it is.

          I never said I hate homosexuals. I never said homosexuals can’t get into Heaven. And if you don’t believe in Heaven, why do you care? If some homosexual activists are seeking recognition and approval from religious authorities, they have to conform to the religion’s doctrine … not the other way around. If they don’t seek approval, then why do they care if Muslims, or Jews, or Christians think they aren’t going to Heaven?

          How are religious leaders pushing “intolerance and hatred?” By not performing wedding ceremonies? How fascist! Seriously, tell me how.

          And I’m still waiting for you to tell me what kind of immoral activity I am guilty of participating in. Is it the time I spend volunteering at the women’s shelter? Or the food pantry? Is it the money I give to my church? Or to the Red Cross? Is it paying my taxes on time every year? Or is it raising my children to show compassion to people? Yes, I think homosexuals face a very difficult challenge if they believe in God and Christ and Heaven. Yes, they have to deny their Earthly desires … and it may be harder for them than it is for me not to drink, or gamble or whatever. But they don’t have to follow my faith. I never said they did. If they want to be married in my church, they do. Sorry, it’s kind of a part of the whole “having a pastor perform the ceremony” thing. If they want a judge to do it, what’s to stop them?

          I don’t care if same sex couples marry. It doesn’t bother me or change anything about my life. Just don’t come to me demanding my church’s pastor perform the ceremony.

          • Mike

            At least be honest enough to admit to your scurrilous implications. You did make that comparison and it is dishonest for you claim otherwise.

            It is also an inane thing to compare marriage to animals to marriage between gay adults. The reason… consent. The same with marriage to children. The same with polygamy. Homosexuals wnat the right to marry the single, non related adult of their mutual choice. You want to deny that to them. That is wrong.

            How are you and your ilk pushing their hatred? Simple. The only people opposed to gay marriage are motivated by unreasoning hatred motivated by religion. their is no other reason for such opposition. No one cares what you think about your mythical afterlife but the religious attempts to outlaw gay marriage in the real world are what is wrong. Unless you are openly speaking out for the legality of gay marriage as a religious person, you are wrong.

            I provided the list you request above.

          • Prometheus

            Good word, but you don’t know how to use it. I made no scurrilous claims … I had no intention of defaming anyone’s character, I merely pointed out the obvious flaw in the arguments in context with similar arguments being made by bigamists and NAMBLA.

            How is the polygamist argument not a parallel? Are they not consenting adults?

            And I never said I want to deny homosexuals anything. I don’t care if they get married. They just don’t have a right to demand that a church perform the ceremony. Pretty straight forward. You can discolor it all you like, but it’s pretty simple.

            And your list was a joke. You provided a bunch of opinions with no credence. I don’t care what you think about my religious beliefs, because it doesn’t affect my beliefs. I don’t expect you to share them, and I don’t feel the need to share yours. That’s called freedom.

            But you see freedom in a different lens. You think that because I love God and believe in Christ that I’m somehow offensive to your world view. That my mere existence somehow diminishes your existence and happiness. That because I believe something, that I expect you to believe it to. But the irony is that you honestly think that by telling me my faith is myth and blah blah blah that you’ll change my belief structure. It’s not enough for you to accept that I don’t care what you believe, you have to eradicate any faith anywhere you find it. That’s what you’ve been trying to do. But it’s pure hubris on your part to think you could accomplish that.

            On that same token, I’ve said repeatedly that I don’t care who marries who. I don’t care if multiple people want to marry into the same relationship. Aside from legal age and humanity requirements, I don’t really care … because it doesn’t change anything for me. I don’t care if you marry two men … I don’t. It changes nothing for me. I still go to work. I still raise my kids (and brainwash them with horrible Christian ideas like caring for the poor and helping the sick). I still go to church. I still council unemployed men and women. I still volunteer at the family services center. I still play golf (rarely, but every now and again, just enough to be dangerous). I still honor my wife and spend as much time with her as I can. I still read to my children every night. None of what you do changes any of that for me.

            Who Ellen DeGeneres marries is of absolutely no consequence to me. Who any other person sleeps with is of absolutely no consequence to me.

            You can’t accept that because it violates your narrow view of Christianity and you need that shaded lens to make yourself feel good about the kind of person you are. Call me what you want, it changes nothing.

    • Lorie Mayfield

      while you speak about evangelicals as being intolerant, ask many gay people who practice Islam and speak about how it’s not tolerated in their country. We just say its wrong based on the Bible which is our doctrine, and Islam says its wrong according to the Qu’ran and they stone them, or behead Christians. I have a friend that asked me if I would be offended to know that he was gay, and I said no would he be offended to know that I’m a minister. As a believer I have shared the teachings of the Bible( the Bible is God’s word, I have to say what it says) that is my charge. I don’t hate but I must speak the truth, the truth is the Bible says that its wrong. You don’t have to be a Christian or a believer, you are free to worship how you choose. However I am a Christian and I believe in the Bible and it has a standard in which a believer lives their lives. The thing is God hates sin and the punishment of sin is death, however he loves us so much that he came down himself and died for that sin, all he asks is that we believe in Him. The work is already done,are believers perfect no, are some mean yes, but one day we must all stand before God and give an account.

  • Steve

    It figures Wal-Mart would be selling his propaganda. What a shocker.

    • Jen623

      Bet you shop there all the time…c’mon, you know you do!!

    • Prometheus

      Yeah … that bad old Walmart … always pushing religion on people … right next to the Jackass movie and Jillian Michaels fitness videos.

      Walmart sells what people will buy, because they exist to make money. Seems to me there’s a whole lot more crap on the shelf at Walmart than there is wholesome family movies.

  • Boofalicious Washington

    There’s a reason Kirk Cameron is shunned by Hollywood, its an industry that is run by ZINOISTS who are anti-family and anti-Christain

    • Jen623

      It’s all good…he’s doing just fine without ‘Hollywood’ and thank God. Bet he laughs all the way to the bank and good for him!!!

    • Prometheus

      I think you mean ZIONISTS. And I think you’re wrong. Zionists are Jews seeking the establishments and entrenchment of a Jewish homeland and state. I think you would have a hard time even finding ethnic Jews in Hollywood that actually practice the faith. I think you would have a harder time finding entertainment people who support Israel.

      What you really have in Hollywood are secular humanists who see religion as a threat to their version of variable relativist morality.

      • Mike

        Religion is a threat to be feared. It results in the denial of the rights of Americans and the propagation of viscous lies. If it weren’t so tightly controlled in America, it would be resulting in even more murders then it already does (which is quite a few). if it were allowed to involve itself in government the way it’s worst, most foolish, most hateful adherents want, we would soon be seeing beheading in the public square.

        • Prometheus

          If it weren’t for Christianity, you wouldn’t have the rights as an American citizen that you do. The vast majority of Founding Fathers and framers were Christians or deists … and their intentional and conscious actions in the framing of our founding documents, rights and obligations were contextualized by their faith structures. Sorry to disappoint you.

          Christianity did involve itself in government in the Middle Ages and the early Catholic church exercised tremendous influence in politics of all European nations. Ultimately, the abuses of the church led to the Protestant Reformation and the development of modern republican democracy.

  • Maureen

    What a handsome man he has grown into with great values even after being in Hollywood. He is a survivor. Congratulations!

  • Mike

    This low person constantly advocates that the lies of christian creationism should replace the science of evolution. In other words, he spends much of his time lying to children and advocating more lies being thrown at them. There is nothing good about him.

    • Jen623

      How sad you are.

      • David

        every have a threesome?

        • Prometheus

          A few times playing golf, our fourth couldn’t make it so we played the round with just three players.

      • Mike

        How foolish you are.

        • Prometheus

          How unnecessarily angry and bitter you seem to be … it’s sad.

          • Mike

            How arrogant and ignorant you are to not realize that you christians deserve anger and social reprimand for your many evils.

          • Prometheus

            Name one of my “many evils.”

          • Mike

            Condemnation of homosexuals as immoral because of your invalid religious beliefs.

            Trying to push your religious beliefs into science classrooms where they do not belong.

            Acting as if the separation of church and state doesn’t exist simply because you think you should get to proselytize anywhere you want.

            Are three enough? There are more but these should do for now. You really need to loose this unwarranted moral certitude. Following the tenets of the bible do not make you good; quite the opposite.

          • Prometheus

            You haven’t even provided one.

            Again, your opinion of religion has nothing to do with the validity of my beliefs. And I didn’t condemn homosexuals. Those who sin without repentance are doomed to an eternity apart from God … not my plan, that’s God’s plan. If you don’t like it, you can take it up with God. I have no control over that. I’m not trying to push my religious views into classrooms … I put my kids in classrooms where the discussion of religion isn’t feared.

            And the separation of church and state was not a construct discussed as a way of limited religion, but rather of limiting government’s ability to interfere with the free exercise of religion. The framers were pretty clear about their opinion of God, and recognized their faiths in the first sentence of the Declaration of Independence:

            “When in the Course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature’s God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.”

            Further, in documented discussions about the First Amendment from the Congressional Record from June 7 to September 25 of 1789, the Congress decided, “We do not want in America what we had in Great Britain: we do not want one denomination running the nation. We will not all be Catholics, or Anglicans, or any other single denomination. We do want God’s principles, but we do not want one denomination running the nation.”

            In 1799, the SCOTUS issued their decision in an early First Amendment case, saying, “By our form of government, the Christian religion is the established religion; and all sects and denominations of Christians are placed on the same equal footing.”

            In a letter to the Danbury Baptists dated January 1, 1802 (the commonly cited source of the separation construct), President Thomas Jefferson stated:

            “Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between Man & his God, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legitimate powers of government reach actions only, & not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should “make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof,” thus building a wall of separation between Church & State. Adhering to this expression of the supreme will of the nation in behalf of the rights of conscience, I shall see with sincere satisfaction the progress of those sentiments which tend to restore to man all his natural rights, convinced he has no natural right in opposition to his social duties.”

            This statement was meant to reinforce that government would not, because of this procedural separation of church and state, be capable of interfering in the free exercise of religion.

            I think you would like to think that there are miles of citations to support yourself, but honestly, I’d be impressed if you could find one singe citation of a founding father or framer who says that construct was created to keep religion out of government.

          • Mike

            I have provided three. You are simply so far gone into your venal immorality that you think they aren’t. You are the worst sort of person, arrogantly and blindly plodding through life in ignorance hurting everyone around you.

            Why do you think the citation must be from a founding father rather then the Supreme Court? This is where you demonstrate your ignorance of American Government.

          • Prometheus

            Awfully presumptuous there Mike.

            Immoral? Venal? Worst sort of person? Arrogant? Blind? Plodding? Ignorant? Hurting?

            Is this about you or me?

            You don’t know me. I have to assume that what you are doing is venting guilt on me about the path your life has taken. I pity you, I really do … because nothing in our conversation should evoke that kind of distempered anger and contempt. We’ve certainly never met anywhere in person, or I’m sure you would have assaulted me verbally for the horrible person I apparently appear to be to you.

            Do you even understand the purpose of the SCOTUS? It is to interpret the expressed intent of the framers. As such, citing a framer seems more relevant than a panel of men and women seeking to interpret that individual’s intended outcome. Just the same … I’ll play along just one more time on the whole citation thing. My hope is you’ll learn from my example how to do it:

            Board of Education of Westside Community Schools v. Mergens, 496 U.S. 226 (1990): In an 8-1 decision, the Court ruled that the Equal Access Act does not violate the Establishment Clause. The purpose of the Act is to avoid discrimination against student religious and political speech. Allowing student religious clubs on the same basis as other student-initiated clubs is equal treatment, not school endorsement of religion.

            Zelman v. Simmons-Harris, 536 U.S. 639 (2002): By a 5-4 vote, the Court held that Cleveland’s voucher program provided a religiously neutral benefit that gave parents a true private choice among a number of educational venues. Therefore the program did not violate the Establishment Clause.

            The SCOTUS routinely finds that schools exercising religious activities as an institution violates the Establishment Clause, but that the Establishment Clause is not violated by the recognition of religion. The SCOTUS has never ruled on an administrator’s or teacher’s right to maintain a religious faith, only on whether or not they can require students to participate in a uniquely religious service that give the appearance of pushing on faith over all others. This was the same intent as the framers, not to diminish the rights of citizens to practice religions of their choosing, but to restrain government from mandating a particular religion.

    • Prometheus

      The amazing thing is how you, and others like you, insulate yourself from the very same acts of faith that you criticize in others. Christians believe God created the universe and all that is in it, and the homology observed within it is a testament to a single creator, not evolution. You believe that all life evolved from single celled organisms and that humans are descended from apes … but not one time has evidence been confirmed to link the two species together. Because of some similarities you think that a leap of faith to the relationship is reasonable, but it is a leap of faith none the less.

      Nobody disagrees on the subject of micro-evolution. Christians firmly believe God is wise enough to give species the ability to adapt over time.

      The cause of macro-evolution is the one under debate, and as yet no evidence has ever been shown which displays the evolution of one species into another (e.g., primate to human). Cameron does a lot of good. He supports a lot of charitable ventures that do a lot of good for people. It’s very callous to purport him a “bad” person just because you disagree with his religious views. I’m sure his kids are just fine. Plenty of upstanding and highly intelligent people have believed and do believe in creationism. Just because your faith in an evolutionary leap that hasn’t ever been documented seems secure to you doesn’t mean you aren’t the one making the erroneous leap of faith.

      • Mike

        Christians can think what they want. Everyone is entitles to their opinion. No one is entitled to their own facts and sadly, the creationist beliefs you describe are contrary to fact. Science classes in publicly funded schools are obligated to teach the facts of science as they are best understood. To do anything else is promotion of the christian faith, which is illegal and immoral.

        The evidence of evolution absolutely exists. Only the blind and ignorant can deny it.

        You accuse others of acting on faith because, I would guess, that is the only way you can function. Don’t project your weaknesses onto others.

        There are no such things as “micro” or “macro” evolution. these are idiotic terms made up by creationists to create a trap for the simple. There is only evolution. It is a fact and your denial of it says far more about you then it does about the world.

        By the way, humans are primates. learn something before you speak for a change.

        Until this self-important fool and mindless little people like you stop trying to brainwash children with obvious lies, you are bad people and you simply need to accept that.

        • Prometheus

          Mike,

          Wow … you do know how to mislead, don’t you? Immoral? I think you stretch a little far.

          I am not making up facts. In fact, I presented the current status of evolutionary theory pretty succinctly so even one such as yourself could understand. There is no accounting of evolution from one species into another in the fossil record. There just isn’t. If you know of one that hasn’t already been shown to be fraudulent please share with the rest of the class.

          Actually, the promotion of Christian faith is the first protected right in the Bill of Rights.

          “Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.”

          Yup, that’s it right there … in the first 10 words of the first amendment to the Constitution and the first right in the Bill of Rights. Yeah … kind of hard to avoid that one.

          You will notice there is no law in any part of the US code of law that says it is illegal to be a Christian, or the carry a Christian worldview, or to let your faith be represented in your teaching. That’s the lie. It is a societal standard in public schools, not a law. It is a policy … that’s not the same thing.

          There is such a thing as macroevolution … I won’t trouble you with moribund hyperlinks. You can google it yourself.

          And humans are considered primates because of an, as of yet, unproven link between humans and primates that is theorized to have split more than 65 million years ago. However, that link has never been found. It is assumed because of observable similarities between human and primate genetics and behavior. However, homology is not the same thing as heredity.

          I think you have a huge chip on your shoulder because you know, deep down, that what I’m saying resonates truth. I never said macroevolution hasn’t happened … I said there’s no direct evidence yet to support the theory. As such, belief in the theory is an act of faith, not science. After all, science is merely a process of questioning. True scientists seek to disprove, not prove. Have you ever been introduced to the Scientific Method? The Scientific Method is about establishing a hypothesis and subsequently seeking to disprove it. Modern science is about proving things … but that is a flawed mechanism. Only by proving what something isn’t can you eliminate the challenges to what it is. Macroevolution is still theory. I’m sorry to break your fragile bubble, but it’s true.

          And like I said, evolutionary theory doesn’t scare me. I have complete faith that God could create life capable of vast mysteries. And we teach our children all sides of the discussion, because we owe them that. It is public schools that are afraid to expose children (who likely go to church every Sunday) to the concept of creation, not the other way around. You are operating out of fear, not me. I’m not afraid of science. After all, the first scientists existed to explain God’s creation. That’s awesome.

          And I guarantee you that my kids, and their Christian private school education, will be far better prepared for life than what your local public schools are able to produce. We sacrifice greatly to provide that resource for our children. After all, evolution and creation are only a small part of the divide between public and private schools. You don’t have to do a whole lot of research to see how much better private schools do the job.

          • Mike

            So much wrong. You do not present current science. You present the silly creationist caricature of it. Only your ignorance of the subject allows you to say such foolish things with a straight face, assuming this isn’t a Poe.

            The seperation of church and state is guaranteed in the first amendment. You are as ignorant of American government as you are of science. You have the right to speak about your religion, the government doesn’t. I also have the right to correct you when you make incorrect statements.

            You are very wrong about the rights of teachers to present their religion in a public school classroom. it is utterly and justly illegal.

            Your next several statements are again only showing your ignorance of science. I will not dignify them with an answer. You also don’t know what a theory is.

            Your faith in creationism is just sad. You deny all the facts of biology because a book that tells patent lies like a world wide flood says to. It’s just pitiful.

            Taking your children into your demon haunted world with you, perverting their minds with simple minded foolishness, and refusing to teach tghem science will not produce well-prepared adults. It will produce buffoons like you who think they are well prepared but are in fact a drag on society.

          • Prometheus

            Mike,
            You have a funny definition of “guaranteed.” I cited the entire First Amendment for you … if you would be so kind, please cite for me where that Amendment distinguishes the separation between church and state. I will let you try, but you (predictably) will fail. The concept of the separation of church and state was debated and documented in letters, but never legislated into law. And the intent behind it was to prevent the government from limiting or interfering with religious freedom and the exercise of religious beliefs. It doesn’t say “except for elected officials,” or “except for public employees.” You can look. I’ll wait. Nothing? Like I said … predictable.

            Also, please cite the law that prohibits the presentation of religious thought by teachers. You will find that is a policy, and one that is interestingly inconsistent in its application … because some religious thoughts are allowed to be presented and others are not. There is certainly no reasonable foundation for denying religious holidays that more than 75% of the nation observes (according to the last polls on religious affiliation from 2012).

            You have a lot of anger, and it’s kind of funny to read, but it’s more sad. You will find that my children are far better prepared for scientific study than the average comparable grade level public school student, because private schools can teach a variety of perspectives. Even Catholic schools teach evolution, because it’s a valid area of study … but they aren’t so closed off about the limitations of the work that has been done to date.

            You can call me whatever you like … you still haven’t overcome any of my examples of the weaknesses of the macroevolutionary theories. The link between humans and apes is suggested, not documented. The supposed relationship is based on biological similarities (called homology), not on documented fossil records. The supposition is that we share a common ancestor from more than 65 million years ago, but that’s still just conjecture, because that ancestor has not been found.

            Cats and horses share a lot of similar quadrupedal traits and behaviors, but they aren’t related. Just because the both have two eyes, two ears, one mouth, one nose, and four legs doesn’t mean they share an ancestor. You should really read up on what creationism really says instead of taking the Air America version at face value. There is no doubt that evolution is occurring … but what has been documented is evolution within a species to suit the changing conditions of the world around it … not the evolution of bugs into fish.

            It’s funny you would say a private school is “demon haunted,” that actually caused me to chuckle. You keep depending on that obviously failing public schools system and see where it takes you. You have a lot of bitterness about that, maybe because you know private schools are just flat better and feel like it’s something that’s out of your reach. Maybe it’s because you are actually deluded enough to think that public schools are really doing a good job.

            Either way, that’s your issue to resolve. Just know that your public high school graduates (or drop-outs, whatever you’re raising) will someday work for my private schooled “buffoons.” And if it weren’t for people like us, you would have a larger tax burden to account for, because we pay a LOT in taxes. You’re welcome. That should give you some comfort.

          • Mike

            It is amusing watching yet another christian twist and bend trying to make things conform to their false mindset. I will tell you but your, perdictably, will not understand since you are blinded by faith. The separation, as interplayed by the writers and many subsequent SCOTUS rulings, lives in the first clause. You not understanding that does not change it. It is the law of the land whether you like it or not and you and all your ilk must obey it, like it or not.

            The law the prevents religion being taught in school? The first amendment. That’s easy.

            I do have a lot of anger at christian right wing zealots. they say my secular nation was founded on their principles when it wasn’t. They say that their silly religion deserves to be bowed to by my government even though that is antithetical to what America really stands for. You want to substitute your silly misunderstanding of science and your myths for real facts in science classrooms.

            You need to stop bragging about your children and the parenthetic education they will receive if religion is presented in the classroom. You are trying to produce mindless drones like yourself and we can only hope that your children will be nothing like you.

            You also need to stop talking about evolution. You are simply ignorant and I will not dignify your stupidity with the facts. they are readily available and only your sheep-like, dull dedication to christian propaganda keeps you from understanding it. You are wrong and until you accpet that, nothing you say on the subject will be of any value.

            I am intimately aware of what creationism says and it is all a pack of lies designed to deceive the weak minded. Don’t imagine for a moment that any of the idiotic points you mistakenly think so great are new to me.

            I didn’t say your faith schools were demon haunted. I said that your sadly limited little world is, with it’s gods and monsters and magical animals coming from no where. I was telling you not to abuse your children by driving them into it with you.

            It is actually your issue to resolve. You are the one who believes in a god that doesn’t exist. You are the one who denies the facts about the way the world works because of your silly bronze age religion. You are the pathetic fool who doesn’t understand the harm you are doing or how you deserve the anger of decent citizens.

            Oh, by the way, if you want to do a socio-economic comaprison, compare Atheists to christians. Atheists make more (thus paying more per captita), give more to charity, have a lower divorce rate, and have far lower rates of criminal conviction.

          • Prometheus

            Mike,
            Again … if it is the law, cite it. The SCOTUS refused to hear the case last time it came to their level, so no, it’s not the law of the land. It’s a policy, not a law.

            I never said my kids get a better education because religion is presented in the classroom. I said public school kids are getting a worse education … period.

            You won’t “dignify” my statements about evolution because you aren’t as informed as you thought you were. I laid it out pretty clearly and all you have to cite is one relevant reference … but you can’t. That’s okay. Disappointment is part of life. It’s how you persevere that matters.

            As for your “statistics” … cite them. I can do the same thing … Christians make more than Atheists. See, disprove me. Show me the real stats on divorce, crime and charity … I’d love to see those.

            You have a lot of hot air, and very few salient points. I’ll pray for you.

          • Mike

            You are to big a fool to benefit from a citation of fact. that is clear from your dismissal of evolution. I will tell you the favcts. if you choose to foolishly ignore them, that is your problem. It doesn’t change the truth and that you are wrong.

            You keep acting as if you know something about the science of evolution yet you keep saying stupid things. Learn something. When you are able to understand what I say without lengthy explanation perhaps we can talk.

            It is amusing that your answer to things is prayer, an activity shown to nit work. Again, the science is against you and all your whining won’t change that.

          • Prometheus

            I guess I’ll refer to Proverbs 17:28, which says “Even a fool is thought wise if he keeps silent, and discerning if holds his tongue.” Or, as Mark Twain is said to have paraphrased, “better to be presumed a fool in silence than to open one’s mouth and remove all doubt.”

            You should take both to heart.

            You can’t provide a citation. And again, I never dismissed evolution, I just said there’s nothing in the fossil record to support the evolution of one species into another. I also stated that the progress of the birth and death of species is a process of replacement, not symbiosis. Have you ever bothered to ask why, if Homo Sapien is the only human species on the planet, and monkeys and apes are still around and related to us, why Cro-Magnon and Homo Erectus aren’t still around? Why would our distant ancestor still be here, but our less distant ancestor be gone? After all, we were supposedly competing for the same resources. If that competition produced the end of Cro-Magnon and Homo Erectus (among other humans), why not apes?

            I’m not saying we’re not related, I’m saying there’s not evidence to support it yet. Until there is, I think we aren’t. Just drawing a nifty picture of how you think it happened isn’t the same thing as actually finding evidence.

            Prayer doesn’t work for those who don’t believe. Seems to work for me. I don’t hear whining in my comments, but I hear plenty of it in yours. You have authored a couple hundred words now of blind ignorance, but accuse me of whining and failing to maintain the competence to discuss citations you are unable to provide. Go ahead, do your Google thing and learn something. If you are able to find something of value to actually craft a discussion, I’m happy to have it.

          • Mike

            You advising me on how not to look like a fool while you deny evolution is vastly ironic. Here is an example; you say “I never dismissed evolution, I just said there’s nothing in the fossil
            record to support the evolution of one species into another.” Sheer idiotic ignorance of the science. It is inexcusable, really, for such ignorance to exist in a time and place where information is readily available. You vapid “questions” about the existence of humans while many of it off shoots aren’t is again sheer ignorance of which you should be ashamed.

            You keep saying there is no evidence but there is. Your arrogant, ignorant dismissal of it does not change that. The only reasonable explanation is that your religious convictions have blinded you to the truth. You are asked to decide between your unreasonable, faith based assumptions and reasonable, fact based science when they disagree and for some reason that passes understanding, you prefer the unreasoning position.

            Prayer doesn’t work at all. Double blind studies of the effects of prayer by adherents to various religious groups have shown that it has no effect on health outcomes.

            You don’t hear whining? That’s because you seem to think that your whining is coherent discussion when it isn’t.

            You are simply uninformed and seem to expect me to take the time and effort to provide evidence that you will not understand and dismiss. No. I will not play that game with you. You need to either learn something for yourself.or keep crowing out your idiocy.

          • Prometheus

            You like that word “arrogant” don’t you? Does it start to sound funny if you type it a lot? It does if you say it over and over.

            You have a lot of anger, I’ll give you that … but you’re all velocity and no vector. You can’t answer my questions so you call me a fool for asking them, and yet you cite nothing, reference nothing, and prove … nothing. I haven’t even been original … I just repeated the same challenges others in the evolutionary studies fields have already asked. These are questions anthropologists have been trying to answer for generations, because it flies in the face of other evolutionary discoveries and observations.

            I’m sure you have a lot more to say, so I’ll just sit back and wait. Let’s have it Mike. What’s next?

          • Mike

            I notice you are quoting bible verses as if they meant something. Can you provide any evidence that suggests they are of any validity? Be sure to include an evidence based explanation of verses such as the ones describing the great flood which we know didn’t happen.

            Otherwise, admit that you are a fool who believes things without reason and that you actually know nothing.

          • Prometheus

            I gave you the secular version too (Mark Twain), what more do you want? You are very picky.

            Now you want to debate the Great Flood? I don’t have any interest in starting yet another debate with you knowing your debating style. I would discuss it with a rational person, but you’re just a bully who uses your hatred for Christians as a bludgeon.

          • cultureman

            Brotha Pro. I want to thank you. I too grieve for Mike and Steve. Keep praying for them so they won’t suffer eternal separation from The Father on the day of judgement. As you can see, they will be some of the first volunteers when the antichrist abolishes all religions. The good thing is, we have to keep them talking so we can stay up on the bondage Satan has over them through their speech. These are two of about 90 million Americans in that bondage who promote the twisted kinks of society. I too am sacrificing a great deal keeping my child in Kings Valley Christian school. I’ve been down with Kirt since he and his wife got saved. One of his movies got me to block all access to internet porn from myself so that I won’t be tempted. Christ used him to make a movie on subject matter that even christians suffer from which saved my marriage. Most think we are holy than thow, but are blind to see we are not. We struggle with the same sin. This is why my family and I will live in chaos (christ-has-all-our-solutions) until we meet our father.

  • Smartnsexy

    What I object to is the “image” that celebrities try to project instead of just being themselves. Kirk Cameron is being himself in being a God-fearing family man, and that’s fine. Those who relate to that will gravitate towards his work, while others will gravitate toward the work they relate to and the personalities they relate to. Each of us have a different life experience, and our personalities usually reflect that experience. So I would encourage celebrities, anyone really, to be who they are. I think in the long run we’d all be happier if we did that.

  • Michelle Magyar-Vaheed

    Kirk is as harmless & resembles Ned Flanders from the Simpsons but like all highly religious beings they say something out of line or context that will piss someone off. Religion is the worlds number 1 big argument & issue. Millions of people have been murdered, slayed, tortured because of religion. Millions have died from trying to protect it, believe it, worship it, or speak it. This will continue to happen for centuries to come. The only way to combat this is to simply tolerate & believe what you feel w/o any influences. The bible & the Koran can be perceived differently and used out of context to fit what someone else wants you to believe! We have to be smarter than this and think for ourselves. So let ole Ned Flanders aka Kirk Cameron speak his piece. Its up to us to CHOOSE and tolerate his views and not fight to the death or argue about it.

    • Prometheus

      And even more millions have been slain in the interest of secular ambition. You don’t have to look far, World War II is a pretty great example. You can’t lump Christianity and Islam together, to do so displays and vast ignorance of either religion. They are very different and the Koran and Bible are very different. Anyone knowledgeable about Islam knows that the Koran is not the driving force behind a Muslim’s day to day life, the Hadith is. To discuss religion, you must first do the due diligence of knowing something about it beyond the name of the text or the key figure (Christ, Mohammed, Buddha, etc.).

      You don’t have to watch his movies. You don’t have to read articles about him. He’s not calling for anything other than for celebrities to respect their status and treat it accordingly. I wish more celebrities did. It would be refreshing if more in the entertainment industry were known for more than their depravity.

      • Mike

        Of course Islam and Christianity are nearly the same thing. They are male dominated abrahamic religions that have historically generated quite a lot of strife and violence. They share the quality of persuading a lot of people to believe in them in spite of their being zero evidence for either.

        You are not telling the truth when you say that Mr. Cameron is not calling for anything. He is constantly calling for christian creationism to be taught instead of actual science, an immoral and illegal position.

        • Prometheus

          Again, you have a funny concept of morality and legality.

          Nothing Cameron says is illegal. If it were, there wouldn’t be any Catholic schools left in the nation.

          And to state an equivalence like that between Christianity and Islam is a testament to your ignorance of both. I have spent decades studying Islam and Arabic culture, and you obviously have only the MSNBC version.

  • ncearle

    Thanks Kirk for standing up for speaking God’s truth. More believers need to have the boldness to go the “Way of the Master” instead of being afraid to defend the Almighty God. Some day, every knee will bow and now is the time to praise the power of Jesus. Every body these days can have an opinion but those that follow Christ. I’m glad I serve an Awesome, Loving God!

  • sunigal2001

    I admire him so. He hasn’t turned his back on his faith . Not easy. Good for him.